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April 26, 2023

#82 Elisha Covey - Love, Life, and Womanhood

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 Episode Run Time: 2:05:03

Elisha is a talented, self-made, multimillionaire businesswoman, entrepreneur, and co-founder of an eight-figure business portfolio as well as being a host of the podcast “The Girlfriends Show”. In this incredibly special two-hour episode, we talk about everything from navigating life, love, womanhood, and motherhood, and what has made her into the amazing woman that she is today.

00:00:00 00:00:55 Encouraging Independence on Kids
 00:05:19 Instagram and Setting Rules and Guidelines
 00:09:46 The Line Between Shepherding and Passive Parenting
 00:13:32 Encouraging Independent Thinking
 00:15:01 The Sex and Porn Conversation
 00:18:09 Body Count, Giving Away Your Virginity, and Sex Outside of Marriage
 00:22:13 Men Who Lose Respect
 00:23:26 Women Who Talk About Masculinity
 00:26:38 Normalize Changing Our Minds
 00:27:38 Maintaining Working and Romantic Relationships With Your Partner
 00:30:30 King-Queen Archetypes
 00:34:29 Relationship Check-Ins
 00:39:11 “Outwinning the Devil” by Napoleon Hill
 00:41:21 Hormone Cycles
 00:47:45 The Magic of Food
 00:50:48 Our Body is Magic
 00:57:57 Navigating Birth Control With Your Daughter
 00:58:50 Having Agency Over Your Body
 01:03:46 Testosterone in Women
 01:08:35 Candice’s Autoimmune Disease and the Medical Establishment
 01:12:23 Trusting Women’s Gut
 01:14:55 Balancing Romance in Interdependent Relationships
 01:19:35 Always Assume the Best From Your partner
 01:23:19 Be Open to Receiving
 01:25:37 Exercises for Bad Parenting Days
 01:27:50 Different Stages of Motherhood
 01:29:05 Carl Jung’s Devouring Mother Archetype and Disney’s “Bao”
 01:31:41 Alternative Workshops in Praising Women
 01:45:07 Healing Aspect Between the Two Divine Energies
 01:49:06 Elisha’s Mission of Connection and Enlightenment
 01:53:54 Needing a Direct Apology and Holding Grudges
 02:01:09 Meditations in Receiving and Manifesting
 02:04:00 Where to Find Elisha

Husbands and Partners

Elisha’s role in business is very masculine, and she learned that if she couldn’t harmonize the masculine and feminine energy, it was going to ruin her marriage. It’s an ebb and flow of adjusting to each other’s wants and needs, and the importance of being honest with each other. Being with a partner means being willing to evolve, change, learn, and adjusting to the person you love. Elisha doesn’t also believe in the “King and Queen” archetypes going all over social media. Men and women are different and we each create the relationships we want, how we want to behave in them, and especially knowing what your spouse is looking for.

Womanhood and Parenthood

Candice talks about the short movie “Bao” which is about parenting and the “Devouring Mother” archetype and how some moms who are reluctant of letting go of their children growing up and being their own person. The moral of the story is that it’s important, especially for moms of boys, to let their sons step into their manhood. For men, it’s also important that they offer a safe space for their daughters to be vulnerable. Men should also show their daughters that they can be trusted and that they can be safe and comfortable around them.

Links and Resources

Instagram, TikTok, YouTube


Businesswoman and all-around superwoman Elisha Covey talks about love, life, and womanhood in this special conversation-filled two-hour episode.

Support the show


0 (0s): What I've also learned as I aged is that's your opinion. So thank you for sharing that. I'm gonna process it and think about it and then I'm gonna decide if there's anything I want to adjust on my side. Because before I used to accept it and immediately implement and it's like, no, I'm not the Alicia you want me to be. I'm gonna be the Alicia that I want to be and you can accept me or not. That's your choice as a human, you're, you don't get to decide who I am. 2 (28s): Thank you so much for coming all the way to North Carolina for this. I'm so excited. Especially after our dinner last night. I'm like, I, we are just gonna have so much fun today. 0 (37s): Oh no, I'm excited. It's my pleasure. And it's so beautiful. When I was coming over I was like, could there be any more gorgeous azaleas? 2 (44s): So it's the perfect time of year. We actually have this thing called Azalia Fest and it's the first week of April and we have an Azalia Queen and she goes on this float downtown and there's this giant garden party that everyone does. It's beautiful 0 (56s): Girl. Now I'm just gonna come to your house guest for like the next two weeks. 2 (59s): Everyone wears these giant floral dresses and the hats and the gloves. It's a 0 (1m 4s): Whole thing. Okay, I'm gonna have to Google that. Yeah. Cause I've never heard of it, but I just, I mean they're, I've seen azaleas. We have them in Texas but not like this. I'm like, it's sheets and sheets of them everywhere. 2 (1m 13s): Oh yeah. You should take gorgeous a long way out of the neighborhood later. Okay. And you'll just see all of the flowers. They're gorgeous. It's my favorite time of year, so 0 (1m 19s): Thank you for inviting me. I'm like My pleasure. 2 (1m 22s): Of course. So we were talking and we're like, hold it for the podcast. We're gonna probably jump around and I always joke that I have these notes and we ended up having like a three hour dinner. So notes are not needed. Not necessary. No. When you connect, when you're actually trying to connect. Yeah, I guess we're gonna start with Parenting. So that's the top of my mind right now. And I think that you have a cool perspective cuz you have a boy and a girl. I just have two boys, so I'm a boy mom, but I was once a young girl that made many mistakes just like probably everybody else. So my perspective is just based off of my own, you know, upbringing. Like I don't have actual daughters to kind of frame it around. But there's this idea that it's Maintaining agency and autonomy and like Encouraging that Independence in your kid, which I think is beautiful, right? 2 (2m 4s): Like that's hopefully what every healthy parent wants for their kid is for them to be able to fly out of the nest and not need your help. But there is like a ma a process of maturing that requires, it's like you almost unlock different levels, right? As you age. And now I can, I can deal with bigger problems and I can understand like the gravity of certain situations. Maybe it's an outfit that I choose to wear or a decision if I decide to go drinking, like maybe I'm 16 and put myself in certain situations. So at what point would your daughter be able to come to you and like let's say it's something over social media and let's say you're very against her signing up before a certain age and maybe, well let's take it back. We'll say she's 13, so she's 13 and wants and Instagram, you're like, honey, I just don't think it's a good idea. 2 (2m 48s): And you can maybe provide her with data, whatever your perspective is. And she comes to you and she's like, mom, I know what's best for me. I know what's best for me because I'm me and, and I have a perspective that you don't have because it's my own, my own agency essentially. And cool of course to like some point, but 13 seems awfully young to me. Like I made some really big mistakes at 13. So how do you encourage Independence but also maintain the responsibility of being the mom And, and you do know better in some situations. Like you just have experienced more life than her and that just, its, 0 (3m 23s): That's such an interesting dynamic that you're bringing up. And I mean love me or hate me, I'm just gonna tell you what I think, right? Yeah. So this is spur of the moment. It's not like we're just shooting the shit here basically. But the way that I feel is whenever I approach these tough conversations with my kids, I try to go in with curiosity and open-mindedness. Not I know better because I have life experience because all of my life experience is based off of my life with my inputs and things have changed so much even in the last two years with technology. I can't even, and I have a post about this, I can't even really understand the world my children are growing up in. 0 (4m 6s): We just didn't have, I mean we went to the library. I remember asking my mom, probably 90% of my questions never got answered as a child because you couldn't get an answer. My mom would be like, well go to the library. And I'm like, end search where I'm asking you a question. If you don't know the answer, just tell me you don't know it now. I mean everything's at your fingertips. You just Google and you get an answer. And so I think as a parent, it's really important that you have set, you know, Guidelines for your children, but be flexible. You know your child, you know, if they can be trusted, you know the values that you've given them and passed on. So for instance, with my children, I don't have a problem with them having Instagram. 0 (4m 48s): We're not gonna be on it all day every day. And, but we have a very open relationship. So if they see something that they're like, Ooh, they'll bring it to me and be like, what do you think about this mom? Or let's talk about this. I also feel like a lot of times by creating secrecy and ooh, that's not good or I don't want them to know about this or we don't talk about this. It creates intrigue in them and then you're either gonna, you're gonna be the one to tell them or they're gonna find it out from someone else. And my ex father-in-law told me that and it was the best piece of advice I think I've ever received. You're either gonna be the first or the last with your kid and the first one is the one that makes the biggest impression. So you better take those, those chances to impart the way that you view things. 0 (5m 29s): That doesn't mean that they're gonna view it the same, but you have that chance as the parent. So I try to never steer away from uncomfortable conversations. I try to just remember it's just life. I dunno if that answered your question. Kind 2 (5m 40s): Of, I guess to dig a little bit deeper with that. So yes, our US growing up was wildly different. Different yeah. Than them growing up. But couldn't you say that in our age that we understand other people's intentions a little bit better? So there's almost this naivete when you're younger and all. Yeah. You think people, you automatically assume the best. And I think that's a beautiful thing. But I think one of the very valuable things that you get with age and time is you get a more honest perspective of reality. Yes. So if you have social media for example, it's something that seems like a harmless tool, right? Especially if I'm in charge and like you trust me to not go on it all day and to go on the right accounts short. 2 (6m 21s): But do you trust the other people on the other side because we know it's rampant with predators. Like this is just one example, right? Yes, yes. Of like a, of a young person thinking something is harmless and I know what's best for me because all of my peers are doing it and then if you're not letting me do it, then I'm being left out. All of these things. But there, there's a lot of nuanced problem solving that we have to do. So I guess it's in that situation like couldn't you argue that you do know better? Like if she's like, I know better than this, or if she's trying to maybe wear something a little bit more mature cause we all did that, right? Yeah. Like we're trying to experiment what is what is right is good. Yeah, yeah. And like being a woman and how do I wanna present myself? And there's nothing inherently wrong with like a crop top and short shorts or you, you know what I mean? 2 (7m 3s): Not at all. But you have to understand the gravity of making that decision, like putting on that outfit, putting on makeup, putting on heels, that does say something to the observer, right? And you just have to understand that not everyone's intentions are pure. So like consciously consent to the things that you're doing. Yeah. And at certain ages it's just not possible unless you have input from like an older wiser woman or man. Yes. 0 (7m 25s): I, I mean I think you're hitting the nail on the head. It's not that you want them to do what you want because you said and because you know better, it takes more time to parent in the way that you're talking about. Because for me, conscious Parenting is do I have more history in the area? Of course. So if I haven't gained knowledge from that, well that's sad because I want to pa be able to pass that on. But it's being able to share that knowledge and allow them to get to the point where you are without forcing it down their throat. So my question in regards to like the crop top and the outfit or Instagram and predators would be to try to educate as much as possible on the front end. 0 (8m 6s): So for Instagram it would be we, we just have rules about talking to people we don't know. So it's like, if it's your friends, then that's fine. And if it's somebody else, please do not. And if somebody else reaches out to you, let me know so that I can check it out. So we have rules, but I'm gonna trust that they are going to understand those rules after we've talked about it and why, and then follow them. And so breaking trust, we've have that conversation too that like if you break trust, then there are repercussions for that because if you do that, then I can't trust you to have this and we'll have to remove it. So I think setting the outline and the expectation allows them to have the thing that they want and be like, cool, my mom's on my side. And then it puts the responsibility in their court of, hey, we have set Guidelines and we agreed on these things and you understand why. 0 (8m 50s): So just make sure you follow them. And then of course as a parent, it's your job to check in, right? Right. So you can't expect them to do that, you have to do that. And then on clothes and stuff like that, I think it's really important to teach people about teacher children, about how they're portraying themselves. So I mean the crop top in shorts might be cute for certain events, but maybe not for other events. So it's important to teach those things. And I think a lot of times in our fast paced society, it's just like, forget taking the time to teach just force. No, that's not appropriate. But why is it not appropriate? You know, take the time to talk with them. They're humans. 2 (9m 25s): No, that's a really good perspective because it's, it's based in reality. It's not trying to shelter them from the world or potential consequences. And then they have the tools to adapt if they need be. So it's not like they're left out there without any experience in the situation. 0 (9m 38s): Yeah. And these are all little things. It's like we have the chance to teach them these, these tools and these thought patterns with little things. And if we don't do it now, the things just get bigger and bigger as they age and then they don't know what to do with them. But if you show them, oh this is how I reasoned this, this is why, and you take the time to explain, you're teaching them the thought pattern and then they can apply it in other areas. So you're giving so much more than a a lecture about what you're wearing today. Right. 2 (10m 6s): So where is the fine line between that guidance and kind of like that Shepherding, which I think is beautiful and that's the way that I try to pair as well as is a guide. Like I'm not here to dictate anything to you, but I wanna present you with all of the information that I have. And then hopefully you make the decisions that are best for you and best for the family, et cetera. But what is the line between Shepherding Encouraging that Independence and then just like Passive Parenting and maybe like, or 0 (10m 29s): Just let 2 (10m 30s): Them do anything, right? And like a self sabotaging way. Like maybe you think you're doing it in order to encourage that freedom, but really like you're just checked out as a parent and like you don't want them not to like you, so it's okay, well you must know best at 13 you don't, you're 13. Yes, there's a lot of life and a lot of lessons that are coming your way, but they're not there yet. 0 (10m 47s): Yeah, no, I agree with that. And I think a good way to check in for adults, which, which 1:00 AM I doing is am I actually taking the time to go through the thought process? So if you're sitting there and taking the time to talk with them and hear their feedback, hearing their feedback doesn't mean you change the rule. It just allows them to understand that my parent has created a safe place for me to voice these things. And what I try to teach them is, or with my kids a lot of times is hey, this is how I see it. And then I let them bring how they see it and I'm like, I know we can find a common ground, let's work on that together. And that also teaches 'em problem solving skills. It's like they're gonna have all of these scenarios come up and the scenarios just get bigger and bigger as they go into the workforce. 0 (11m 29s): They go to school, you know, college, et cetera. So it's like if you're taking the time to listen, then you know you're not, and from my point of view, you know, you're not doing what, I forget what you called it, but basically lazy Parenting or it's like, oh I just want them to like me. My kids are gonna like me. And even if it's not right now, eventually at some point, you know, when they're older. So I always think long game, I'm like, this is a long game. So even if right now it's a little bit uncomfortable or, or they don't love it, I'm looking for the long term result. 2 (11m 57s): Yeah. So when it comes up to bringing up things first, how have you navigated like I guess timing and age appropriateness of bringing up like really big issues to make sure? Cuz I think I agree 100%. It is so important that you are the first person to talk to your kid about all of those big topics no matter how, especially if they're uncomfortable because it's either gonna be you or it's gonna be like that. You know, sixth grade kid that comes onto the playground has his iPhone. Which one 0 (12m 22s): Do you, and they're doing 2 (12m 23s): It too. Which one do you want it to be? 0 (12m 24s): Yeah, yeah. It's to me, the funny part is, is it's the parents that are uncomfortable. It's not the kids. I'm like, the kids don't know to be uncomfortable, right? So a lot of times what I saw is people don't wanna talk about sex with their kids cuz they're uncomfortable. I'm like, are you serious? Get over yourself. I started having the sex talk with them I think at like four. Oh wow. So there's books about it and it's like, of course it's very scientific then, you know, very like, oh this is how this works. And you just kind of keep retouching it year after year, gently adding more and then of course their curiosity kicks in. And I think for me, where I felt like damn I did it right was two summers ago we were in, so my son's almost 15, so he would've been almost 13. 0 (13m 9s): We were in Hawaii and he, we were sitting out on the lanai and it was a beautiful evening and he just came and sat on the edge of my chair and was like, mom, how did he say it? He was like, yeah, the boys at school are looking at Porn. And he just went straight into it, like super cool, super chill. I was like, oh really? What do you think about that? He was like, well it's kind of weird. And, and just went into it. And I was like, you know what? He feels so comfortable just to bring up Porn and sex and all of these things. I would so much rather him tell me than Knot did. I love it. No, but am I realistic? Yeah, I mean they're 13 year old boys, what do you think they're doing? So you can put your head in the sand and pretend that your kids aren't, or you can be a realist. 0 (13m 49s): Just like I would rather be real. Yeah. 2 (13m 51s): So how do you, how do you handle that? Like how do you, I guess, encourage him to think about it independently? He obviously has probably pressure from his peers if everyone is doing it. Yeah. And you have your own values within your home. Like how do you, like, that's a really tricky situation to navigate. 0 (14m 7s): Well I, I really just listened to him just, I was like, I was like, so how did that, I always ask about feelings. I'm like, so how did, what did you think first? Because especially with boys, they're so thought driven. Mm. So I try to engage that part first because they're comfortable with that usually. And then feelings sometimes are a little bit harder. So warm up with, what did you think? And he was like, well, you know, I think they just do it. One of them got caught and got in big trouble, you know, whatever. And then how does it make you feel? And what he said was like, it doesn't really make me feel good. And I was like, really? Why do you think that is? He was just like, I don't know, it's just gross and kind of weird. And I'm like, oh. And then just dig, dig deeper, be curious. He figured it out on his own. I didn't have to tell him, don't do that. 0 (14m 47s): That's awesome. He said it made him feel weird. And so it's like, okay great. And I, I was just like, well if you wanna talk about it more, let me know. I don't feel the need to, don't do that again. Whatever. I'm sure you will do it again. 2 (14m 59s): Yeah, kids then he won't come to you in 0 (15m 2s): The future. And really when you break it down, it's like, okay, I can jump on his ass and criticize him and his friends and make him nervous to talk to me again and tell me he won't do it. Or I can just be a realist and let him tell me how it makes him feel. Because then it made him uncomfortable. So I was like, okay, 2 (15m 20s): Hey everyone, this is new. So we are taking a quick break for a couple of sponsors. How exciting is that, that we have a couple sponsors for the podcast. So this is new. Please don't skip it, just listen, it's cool stuff, I promise. So my first one is a small company called Ragnar's Rocks and I'll make sure I have the link below. As you know, I love crystals and I get made fun of for it all of the time, but I'm, I'm not gonna change my ways and I'm gonna stand by it. I truly believe in them and I think that they're beautiful. So Sumy. But he sent me, I mean, how incredible is that? He sent me this beautiful amethyst, I've got this really cute rose quartz skull. 2 (16m 3s): All this is on my table, you can't see. But when I start doing two cameras, you'll be able to see my little setup and this cute little crystal Buddha. How adorable is he? I these bracelets are from there. I mean I was really stoked to have him as a sponsor because this is right up my alley. So if you're into any crystals or you just wanna check out the website, it's wagners rocks.com and I'll link that below. And the last affiliate last sponsor, please don't skip, this one's a good one. So we all know the benefits of fasting. Well my husband and I have used this company ProLon actually a couple of times. So I was really excited that they wanted to be an affiliate of the podcast. 2 (16m 44s): So if you wanna try ProLon, it's a fasting mimicking diet. So you get all the benefits of a water fast and it's a lot easier cuz you get this delicious food instead of having to completely eat nothing. So you can try ProLon for $150 with the code. Candace, some of the claims for, and I mean I say claims, but I'm going off of a script guys, 60% of people that completed the fast had better energy, mental clarity and focus. You'll definitely shed some lbs. I felt a ton lighter after doing it. It's cool to do difficult stuff and obviously fasting is not easy. So it's kind of cool to see how you can kind of push it and get through something that you thought you might not be able to do. 2 (17m 27s): It's a lot easier than just doing a water cleanse. And again, like you, I think the average here, yeah, people lose an average of 5.7 pounds and 1.6 inches off of their waistline. So soon as I'm done breastfeeding, I'm doing one of these and Eric's supposed to be starting anytime now, so we'll see when he decides to start. So I'll link that below again, if you, you wanna try ProLon, you can try it for 150 bucks. Use code Candace and let's return to the episode. So did you get into the conversation of like, this is adult entertainment, this is not an like a accurate necessarily healthy representation of what that's supposed to look like, because that's one of the biggest critiques about pornography and just the availability. 2 (18m 9s): Like I'm a huge advocate for paywalls because of situations like that. There needs to be some way to verify that and it's not a, you know, minor on the other end, but we're not there yet. And then if you don't, you have so many parents that avoid the topic because of that discomfort within themselves or insecurity or shame. So then their kid is left thinking, oh well the, this is what it's like. Right. And I think it's interesting because you have the boy and the girl that the consequences that that can kind of go into for both of them is very different, right? It lead the boy to mistreating a woman or like not wanting to ever be Romantic with somebody because he's so uncomfortable with it and he doesn't understand like that's not normal or a girl to either allow it or the same thing kind of like not be able to experience real intimacy because like she wasn't taught what the healthy version of that is. 0 (18m 56s): I think he was young. Yeah. And so we've touched on it since then too. Yeah. I think then what was important for me to discuss with him, it turned into then a sex conversation, right? Yeah. So it went from Porn to sex, right? And I was like, so you know, I wanted to find out what was going on at school. Are other people having sex? What's going on? Right? And I was just letting him share and he was like, oh god, mom, no, nobody's doing that. And I was like, Hey, you know, it's, I mean y'all are getting there in age. And he was like, no, nobody's gonna be having sex till they're like 18. I was like, I don't think so. I think the average boy loses his Virginity at 16. He was like, oh, I'm like, Google it. I'm like, I'm gonna search it up and it it is, it's 16 and 17 for girls. 0 (19m 36s): He was like, how'd you know? I'm like, I don't know. As a guest, 2 (19m 37s): Huh? He used to be young one time. 0 (19m 39s): Yeah, yeah. And I just told him, for me it was more important for me at that point to remind him that sex is an amazing thing and it's, it's a beautiful thing as long as both people are wanting to do that and it can, you know, it can be a beautiful thing but it can also not be, and so there, my, my driver, my desire was to keep the lines of communication open and I was like, you know what, I'm not gonna tell you you can't have sex till you're married. That's what my family did. Like you're gonna go to hell if you do. So I got married at 18. What a bad decision. Like 2 (20m 10s): If I 0 (20m 10s): Would've had sex with him, I wouldn't have married him. So that's not my goal for them. My goal is that they treat themselves respectfully and others respectfully. So I was like, you know, my, my biggest dream would be that before you have sex with someone, you talk to mom because there's a lot of repercussions to sex that you don't think about. You know, there's STDs, children, et cetera that can come from it. And of course they're like rolling their eyes but I, I think that when that time comes they'll feel comfortable. Yeah. So we just kind of keep broaching the subject a little bit here, a little bit there. And when I see that they're like, okay, then I let them, I feel like they're kids are like bees. Like they're just buzzing on this topic and then buzz in on another and you don't wanna hammer it too much. 2 (20m 47s): No, that's beautiful. You're very fortunate because I think that sounds like the ideal situation. Where was I gonna go with that? I had a good question. 0 (20m 55s): I mean dude, they're not grown yet, so we'll see. I'm like, I think this is working. 2 (20m 59s): No, so okay, this is where I was gonna go. So I think that you're like you sharing that is so beautiful and useful for a lot of people. You just said, you know, your family said if you have sex out out of wedlock, you're gonna go to hell and this is terrible thing. So that led to you getting married at a very, very, very young age and you're like, well if I had sex with him before I wouldn't have married him. 0 (21m 20s): Of course I know 2 (21m 21s): Of course how important that is. But we're almost like I, and I'm sure you've seen this content just rising and thriving or maybe it's my algorithm of this very evangelical trad lifestyle that's kind of coming like resurfacing and it's almost this puritanical culture of that. Like you have to, you have to get married first. Body Count is this huge deal, 0 (21m 44s): Sorry my eyes almost got stuck in the 2 (21m 46s): Back of my head. Cannot sleep with a man or he will not respect you anymore unless there's a ring on the finger and all of this thing. And I'm like, I had a very similar framework growing up where sex was this thing that I could give away and not the man, right? Like he's somehow prote protected and exempt from all this, but it's just for women. So there's this thing in the Virginity, your purity that you give away and once it's gone it's gone forever. There goes your value. So it better be to the one and only man that at some young age you decide is there. But when you look at it and you have that so much weight and shame and pressure on it, you end up with the wrong person because you're like, I just gave this thing away and shit, it was the wrong guy but I can't get it back. 2 (22m 30s): So now what do I do? And then fast forward eight years later, I'm like reclaiming my sexuality and my worth and my value and saying that didn't mean anything. You know, like not anything. Cuz I do think that sex can be what you want it to be. Like if you want it to be like this very spiritual, intimate, connective thing, it can, and if you want it to be junk food, it can. Right? It's, it's how you engage with it. But having all of that pressure and like other people's shame on me left me stuck for such a long time. And I want younger women to know this. It's like you can make sex whatever you, you know, you want it to be like, don't let someone put that pressure on you because it is a very easy way to end up with the wrong person. 0 (23m 10s): Yeah. And I, I think the most important thing is it's what do you feel and believe, you know, of course your Virginity is important, of course it's important who you decide to share that with. But I mean hate me or love me, I think that people make it such a big deal and I think in doing that they create these scenarios where like you said or like me, you marry the wrong person because you feel pressured. You stay in the relationship because, well you gave him, gave him what? What am I not whole now you're hiding because I'm not right. I 2 (23m 45s): Didn't even, no, I gave no I had it to 0 (23m 47s): Give away. Girl, I think I gave that to a tampon. It's like what do those even hang around anymore? Like so no, what did I give? Are you saying that once I have sex I'm no longer worth what I was before. Cut me a break. Your self-worth is not based on that. Now I'm not saying, I mean go out and have sex with every person you, you meet unless that's is that, if that's what you wanna do, you can also do that. But my big thing is, is there respect between the two of you? Do you both go in knowing and do you both go in understanding what you're expecting from the experience? Because it's just an experience. It's like you and I are having an experience right now. You know, we both expected to come and do this and to bring our A game and to have fun and so then it's a healthy experience, right? 0 (24m 31s): And I think sex is very similar. Like what are our expectations from this and have we, are we both able to consent and are we both headed in the same direction? Whether it's just that we wanted to be together and enjoy this moment or we want pursue something, you know, greater. I think the problem happens when we don't communicate, you know, and one of the parties is using it as a way to get something they might not wanna tell you but like, okay if I sleep with them then I get this. Mm or vice versa. It's like that's where the problem comes in. It's communication. It's not the actual act. 2 (25m 2s): So what's your opinion on the men that do seem to lose the respect is, in my opinion it wasn't there in the first place but lose respect for someone once they sleep with them. 0 (25m 11s): I don't know if they actually, I don't know if they, I mean god I'm not a man but I don't know if they actually lose respect or in with younger men it really is built into their dna. The chase. It's just a chase, it's a game. Like any other game, they're playing a game and unfortunately for some women they get to be a count in that game. But that's what I'm saying, if you have that conversation with the person where you guys are on the same page, this is much harder younger, you know, when you're young and you're figuring it out. But I really, and then also if they did lose respect like you said or it was just a number then good riddens. Yeah, move on. It doesn't make any difference to me because my decision was for myself and I can't control you. 2 (25m 56s): So no, I mean I agree a hundred percent. Like I said, I don't think it was there in the first place. Yeah if that's, if you, you know are in this vulnerable space with a man and then all of a sudden he starts treating you like shit, like you just dodge get rid of him a bullet, right? Yeah. Like move on. It's not about you, that's about him. How has the feedback been as a woman that speaks a lot about masculine and feminine almost like Archetypes and relationships and Parenting. Because I know for me anytime I talk about Masculinity especially it's like there's two polarities that pop up. Like one is like thank you so much for offering perspective, like a feminine perspective. And the other one's like, you are not a man, you shouldn't be talking about this 0 (26m 37s): Girl. It's so funny to me. It's like depending on what clip it is, you have a ton of people who love you and a ton of people of people who hate you. And I'm like, yeah, you love me now wait till the next clip. So I think that I don't put much weight in it. It's like, you know what? I think if all of us could just be honest and really connect and share, bringing our thoughts out into the open is what creates change. And it takes polarity to figure out like polarity and like volleyball and conversation we're not, for instance, you and I, we're not sitting here saying that we're right. Like let me teach you something. All we're doing is sharing perspective. And I think the beauty in that is that when we talk with each other, maybe we can both grow, right? 0 (27m 20s): So yeah, some people attack and they don't like it and this and that, but I really don't pay much attention to them. Like I'm just sharing because this is what I feel called to do. So love it or hate it. Delete me or follow me. I don't, doesn't make me any difference. Cause I think the people that want to hear it and need to hear it, God or the universe is gonna make sure that happens. I don't have to. 2 (27m 40s): Yeah and it's kind of discounting the fact that you can recognize just like what a good valuable person looks like. Yeah. Like what does, what does a kind person look like? What is a person, like a high value person look like? Like obviously there's gonna be gender differences but like I can establish someone who is mistreating people at scale versus not. Even if it's just for cliques, like I still don't agree with that. So I think everyone is allowed of perspective and it would be the s the same as me saying I don't want a man's perspective on what it is to be a woman like the, that would include my husband. So I would need to know like his opinion is extremely valuable to me. Extremely valuable. 0 (28m 18s): Yeah, I agree with you. It's like why wouldn't we want perspective, why? Why can't we just be open to hearing? I think it's a huge thing that we need to be talking about. Like just because someone shares their opinion doesn't make it the end all be all. And just because our opinions don't align doesn't mean we can't be friends. It doesn't mean you're more valuable or you're stupid or I'm dumb or none of that. It's just an opinion. And it might change. And I think we hit on this yesterday, like I am 100% okay being a hypocrite. If I am not a hypocrite then something's wrong with me because I'm constantly growing and changing and evolving. And so the things that I thought were the staples of life 10 years ago are very different now. 0 (29m 1s): And so it's just like, can we just all step back and give each other room to grow? 2 (29m 5s): Yeah. We need to Normalize changing your mind. Yeah. Because right now it's looked like you're a flip flopper, you're inauthentic or you're lying or you're a hypocrite. All of these things like no, I've been presented with more time and information and with that time and information I've changed my perspective. I'm allowed to do it. It's actually highly encouraged. You should try it sometime. 0 (29m 23s): Try that sometime, see where you get with people. It just, it makes life, there's so much between black and white. Do you wanna experience or not? And I think that that's something I had to learn because as a young adult I was very black and white and I think it came from my upbringing. It's either right or it's wrong. And now I'm like is there a right or wrong? I don't really know because I'm not gonna judge you. What's right for you might not be what's right for me because of the 30 plus years of experience that I've gone through. Right? And so I try to remember when people act in ways that I don't understand that like, hey, you don't have their inputs, I have no idea what's going on. And you really only know the surface, you know? So you're making judgements off of a lack of information. 2 (30m 6s): So when it comes to, cuz you and your husband have multiple businesses together, how do you, cuz my husband and I do as well, so this is also like a selfish question. How do you maintain that boundary between working relationship and partnership and Romantic partnership? 0 (30m 22s): Oh cool. Maybe, maybe I can selfishly ask you the same thing. It's definitely been an interesting dilemma to figure out. So I think that a lot of times in business, or at least in the businesses that we've had, it's very masculine. My role is very masculine and what I realized a couple years ago is that if I couldn't learn to harmonize between my masculine and my feminine, I was gonna ruin our marriage because my husband didn't wanna be married to a man or he would be right. I was like, if he wants to be gay, he will be gay but he doesn't wanna be. So if I can't learn to you know kind of harmonize between those two and flip that side of me off when I get home, then it's, it created problems for us. 0 (31m 4s): And so I think I've gotten really good at the flip. I think sometimes it's hard for, a little bit harder for him to flip with me. So it's, it's, I mean it's an ebb and flow and giving each other grace and being okay that we're not gonna be perfect. But also honesty like hey I'm done with that. I was like, oh okay, sorry I was doing it again. Like, and Charles is very good at calling me out so he has no problem being like that Uhuh, it's not working for me. Okay, I forgot. You know? So I think it's just being willing to evolve and change and learn and then adjust to the person you love. 2 (31m 39s): How did you get to a place where you could take constructive feedback like that and not take it personal or have that turn into a fight? 0 (31m 46s): Yeah, that honestly, to tell you the truth, my mom was so harsh that it just, I mean I, I think that that created a lot of desires of perfectionism in me. So feedback was always taken and applied. I never had an issue with that. What I have more of an issue with is my self worth being or my ability to be loved being based on what I produce. So accepting criticism and adjusting has never been an issue for me. I think that a lot of people are like, whoa, this girl just doesn't bother her. But the part that I struggle with is remembering that I don't have to be perfect to be loved. You know, you can take that criticism and you can choose to apply it or what I've also learned as I aged is that's your opinion. 0 (32m 34s): So thank you for sharing that. I'm gonna process it and think about it and then I'm gonna decide if there's anything I want to, to adjust on my side because before I used to accept it and immediately implement and it's like, no, I'm not the Alicia you want me to be, I'm gonna be the Alicia that I want to be and you can accept me or not. That's your choice as a human, you're, you don't get to decide who I am. Have 2 (32m 55s): You heard this new, I guess it's not really new cuz like, I think the subject matter's probably been around forever, like for millennia, but it's kind of being rebranded and becoming sensationalized, which is the submissive wife or like those king Queen Archetypes that a lot of counseling will use and like leader and follower. What is your opinion on those dichotomies? Yeah, 0 (33m 16s): That's a good one. I really think that some of them, they're just in our DNA and I think we've tried to fight it, you know, we're equal, we're this, we're that. And I'm like, man, we're not even in the same book. So they're, how, how can you say that, you know, Nancy Drew book is equal to Martha Stewart's book and it's like these, you know, they can both be great books, but they're so different. And so for me it's really realizing that we each create the relationships we want and we can choose how we want to behave in them. And it's really important to understand what your spouse is looking for because some men want a wife who is more masculine, want a woman who goes out and does that role or plays those roles and then he wants to be more, you know, in his feminine or whatever it is. 0 (34m 4s): And then my husband does not. And so it's like you need to be very cognizant of who you are hooking up with or marrying, aligning yourself with. Because if you're not cognizant of those, it's, it can come back to bite you because we can't just assume that because you're a man, this is the role you wanna play and you're a woman, this is the role you wanna play. It's not like that anymore. So I think that's really what it is, is being very curious and open to hearing what the other person wants and realizing that that could change over time. 2 (34m 31s): That's an interesting point. I'm so I just, I love you so much. I love you too. I do. I mean you approach things with so, so much nuance and I think when you see a lot of these cultural personas and influencers, I can always predict what they're gonna say all of the time and they do try to automatically put you in one of those box. Like if you were a man, like you have to be the like in your masculine leader protector and sure that's probably most men I would imagine. But there absolutely are men that wanna be in the feminine, like they want to be the stay-at-home dad. Yeah. And the woman is like this very ambitious, more in her masculine and she wants to go conquer, climb and, and just get promoted up of up that scale. 2 (35m 13s): And that's fine if they, you find that balance between, between your partner and and yourself and 0 (35m 18s): Who are we to judge? I'm like, who am I to say your relationship is right or wrong? I'm not living it. And and if it works for you guys right, then it works for you guys. And I think the biggest thing here that I find intriguing when I see people judging is, oh yeah, well that'll work for them for five years and then watch what happens. And I'm like, and so what if it does does because I don't believe that we can say how long a relationship is supposed to be there for. I believe that we meet for a time when it's right and this meeting is gonna continue as long as it's supposed to. So I am very much like, do I wish that Charles and I will stay married forever? Of course I love him. 0 (35m 58s): He's been such an amazing impact and friend in my life, right? But will I sit here and tell you, oh, we're soulmates and we're gonna be together for fuck now. That's crazy. So it's like, I think that we have to learn to give each other this space to grow and then also understand that just because someone comes in and out of your life doesn't mean that you failed or that it's a failure. I, I think that's such a harsh way to look at things. 2 (36m 24s): Yes. And we do that to ourselves. We are our own worst critic. We're constantly trying to prove to ourselves why 0 (36m 29s): We're unworthy and to everyone else 2 (36m 31s): Unlovable, right? Like, let me find, I have the evidence, let me, let me show I'm 0 (36m 35s): Worthy. And it's like I don't have to prove it to you. I, I just, I just need to feel worthy to myself. And my worthiness does not come from outside inputs. My worthiness comes from me being a human and every single one of us is therefore we all deserve it. So, 2 (36m 52s): So how do you calibrate through, like how do you, how do you do your touch Ins with your relationship? Because like you just said, you can grow in different directions. Yeah. Like maybe something works 0 (37m 2s): The check-ins. Yeah, I, I heard this quote and I loved it and it basically said that every seven years and you know, everybody talks about the seven year itch, but so we'll just stick with the seven years. Every seven years you have the opportunity to have a new relationship and that relationship is either gonna be with the same person but it will still be new or it will be with a new person, right? So we have that choice and it's like, what are you gonna choose to do? And I think it's, it's pretty dead on. I'm like every seven years I do feel like a new person. I've grown so much. So I have the opportunity to check in with my spouse and say, Hey, are you still enjoying this? What are the areas that are working for you? 0 (37m 43s): What areas are not working for you? And can we still grow together? So I think that's something you just have to take it as it goes and, and like you said, check in and I think giving space and grace is so important. Yes. It's just like if you can't give the other person the space to be who they truly are because you have to control, well we have to be married or we have to be this way or that way, then it's like, do you really love them or do you love the idea of being married or the idea of their relationship because you aren't really showing love if you can't support them in their changes, 2 (38m 20s): Right? 0 (38m 20s): Yeah. So 2 (38m 22s): Yeah, I feel like you can't, you can't be in the seat of control and almost like this ownership and also experience love. Like those are not the same things. And we talked about this a little bit last night at dinner. Yeah. Which to me, and I've had the blessing of like my career to really make me sit with what I think and find to know what love and unconditional love is. And I never knew it existed. Yeah. I thought love was always conditional, it always had conditions. You have to be a good boy, I have to be a good girl. You know, like there's all of these like self-imposed often right rules of whether or not I was worthy or you were worthy of that love. 2 (39m 3s): And what I realized is you get to reframe that if you want. Like you can take that programming out and make it whatever you want. And it's, once you break down enough you can realize that with the right person, like there's nothing that you can do that will make me stop loving you. It's not to say I'll excuse behavior or that will be together forever because you are allowed to establish those boundaries. But you can be divorced and still have love for somebody. Oh 0 (39m 26s): My god. Yes, yes. And I couldn't agree more. It's like that's ultimate love. Ultimate love. And I explain it this way with my husband that when I, this is the only way that I can explain it. When I met him, he was a beautiful bird flying and I was admiring wow how graceful and this and that about him. Then you want to take that bird and put it in a cage and you think you're gonna admire and love it the same. No you're not. So let him be free. And of course we talk about our boundaries and our desires, et cetera. And of course respect is, it's so important and honesty and truth, but we have the opportunity to build our relationship in any form we want. And I think that's what people forget. 0 (40m 7s): It's like it doesn't matter what Sally and Brenda and John think about their relationship, that's not my business. My relationship is my business. And so I can create it in whatever form I want. And like you said, I, I know deep in my heart that no matter what happens with Charles and I, even if he was to break our commitments, I will always love him. Doesn't mean I will always be with him of course. Because we have to keep respecting our own personal boundaries. Boundaries are for yourself, not for others. They're the Guidelines that tell you this is what I am willing to live with and accept. And when people cross those, it's not about teaching them a lesson, it's about respecting yourself. 0 (40m 47s): So of course I have boundaries and Charles and I have commitments, but I just know that what he has given me and the love and support that he has shown me, I will forever be grateful for. So I think it's important to leave that openness and that space for each other. 2 (41m 3s): Yeah, I very much agree there. Have you ever read the book Outwitting the Devil by Napoleon Hill? 0 (41m 9s): No, but it's probably good. Oh 2 (41m 10s): My gosh. I get the audio book. Okay. It's the best way to do it because the reader, it's basically an interview with the Devil and the premise to it is that Napoleon Hill had done a bunch of psychedelics, okay? And actually accessed 0 (41m 24s): Get 2 (41m 25s): Out this energy, okay, I'm gonna do it. And was speaking with him like this is like the wives tale event. So who knows, right? So he's interviewing the Devil and for for some reason the Devil has to answer everything with total honesty. Like he has this hold on him. So he's just asking all of the questions that you would probably ask if you were sitting down with, you know, the Devil himself. It's a fascinating book. And what's interesting it was he wrote it and in the conversation like the Devil is like, you won't write this because you will or publish this cuz you'll get ostracized from society. It took over 70 years for it to get published because he died. The wife didn't wanna read like publish it, but she's like, we will be, my name will be ruined, his name will be ruined. 2 (42m 6s): So like it kind of came to fruition. So it came out way, way later and one part of the conversation that he has with him, cuz he gets into religion and a lot of like the social norms of the time and it's crazy how much it holds up like almost 80 years later. But he gets into divorce and the idea that the church instilled, which is divorce is wrong. Like you can't do it right up until Henry the whatever like established his own church. Yeah. Like couldn't do it. And he says that we have this idea of duty and that you owe something to other people and he's like the only person that you owe anything to is yourself. So if you are in a situation where your soul is being depleted or you're miserable, you do not owe that marriage you to stay in it at the expense of your wellbeing. 2 (42m 48s): He said the only exception is when you're raising children. So that is the only time that you have a duty to someone other than yourself. You don't have it to your boss, your lover, anyone else. It is yourself. I agree with that. And then when you are raising children. Yeah. And I thought that was so fascinating and nuanced, especially for the time that it was written. And I just want so many people to read that book because there's so many aha moments that you have and it really makes you think programming that we've been told. 0 (43m 12s): Yeah, no, I think that's phenomenal. You also said something yesterday when we were at dinner and I was like, holy cow, I've never heard it put that way before. Oh we want 2 (43m 22s): Try to find the video. Okay, so we were talking about Hormone Cycles between men and women and the differences between it and how often we are like categorized as unstable or a pain or difficult to navigate because our Cycles and we, we do have hormones and they do change how we present, think, feel, act, all of the things. And you can look at it from judgment and blame and inconvenience. Or there was this spiritual teacher, like a kind of a mystic, 0 (43m 50s): It was a man, right? It 2 (43m 51s): Was a man, a man. I'm gonna try to find the video and then maybe we could like overlay it in here. But he was, he was saying that women's fluidity with their hormones is such a blessing. And it's a blessing For men because men are supposed to be stable. That's why like their Hormone cycle is so predictable and they don't have the swings that we do. They're supposed to be strong and sturdy, independent. How do you become strong, sturdy, independent? You have to be tested. So as women, we exist to test that security of the man. Mm. So we are almost fortifying him and cre like helping him garner and establish his strength. So we work together, it's in in tandem. 2 (44m 31s): We're not at odds. We we compliment each other. And I was like, whoa. I saw that at a show to my husband and he was like, I'm gonna think about it. 0 (44m 39s): I'm gonna think about it. That's what I do. I'm like, I hear and I'm like, let me, yes. Because I think that so often and I'm guilty of it viewing my own cycle that way. Like, oh God, here we go again. You know, instead of understanding that this is Magic and if we really embrace it and lean into who we are and accept instead of trying to be the other sex because we're jealous of their strength and their just consistency that is built into them. They can't help it. It is who they are. Their hormones have one cycle throughout their life, right? And then they have a 24 hour cycle just like we all do. But theirs is just on repeat every, every 24 hours. 0 (45m 20s): We have the same 24 hour cycle as they do. But then we also have a 28 day cycle. So it's like, and nothing in our world is built towards our 28 day cycle. So I mean, and I think most people don't even understand it. They don't even comprehend that the first two weeks after your period ends your like social lubricant basically you are the star of every party. You're feeling great. It's good to go out with you because you attract everyone. Your energy is super high. That's because your body is trying to reproduce. It's welcoming everybody in. And then the next two weeks is really, our hormones are pushing us to really figure out what is going on here. 0 (46m 0s): And a lot of critical thinking, our hormones have dropped. They're more actually like similar to where men are. And so they're critically thinking all the time and they don't get called a dick because the way they behave. But we do because we are so sweet and so nice and then we start behaving like they do. And in business I always was confused. I'm like, wait a minute, you are a dick like this all the time. Why do people get upset by me whenever I go into critical thinking? And it's because it's the difference, right? It's people don't understand that this is normal. So we as women have been kind of pigeonholed, if you will. I feel like as crazy or, oh God, there she goes again. You know, she's bipolar or bi, whatever. 0 (46m 41s): And it's like, no, you just have to understand women's Cycles. And if you will understand, take the time as a woman or a man, you'll get so much more out of your relationships with them. Because it's like, I know in my cycle when I need to take on a new project, I know when I'm gonna be able to hit that hardest. Then I know when I need to be more reserved and you know, guard my time and my space and spend time really critically thinking. It's, I mean, it's what you make of it. 2 (47m 9s): You know what's interesting too, and this is another reason that I just love what you're doing, is we went through this stage and it was kind of in the nineties and maybe like the early aughts where we pretended that our Cycles didn't do anything because we were trying to become men. Yeah. So we're like, how dare you say I'm more emotional. How dare you say that I behave different. How? How? Like, cause people would make the joke, you know, we can't have a woman president because if she's on her period, she's gonna hit the, the war button. Right. Which is ridiculous. Like, that's a ridiculous thing to say. However, we, we kind of jumped to the complete opposite side and we were like, oh, it doesn't do anything. It's not this real, there's no real effect. It just, I just bleed and that's it. There's no other, no other consequences of that. 2 (47m 50s): Right. And then that's not honest. And then we became so disconnected with our body and our cycle, our Minds, our hormones, and then our health suffers for it. You kind of need to know how your body works. And we would always have these older women that would teach us about our bodies. Now it's, you have a mom or an aunt, or sometimes a babysitter that's like, oh, here's a pad, here's a temp on, here's a 0 (48m 9s): Paper, move on, 2 (48m 10s): Temp template to figure out how to put it in. That's it. And then they put you on a birth control pill. I was on a birth control pill from, and I wasn't even having sex. Yeah. From 13 until my mid twenties, like maybe 24 ish. That's a fricking long time. Yeah. And half of the ones I was on got pulled because people were getting cancer. And I'm like, wait, I didn't even know that was a possibility. Or strokes. Yeah. And they're like, oh, well yeah, this, that's not conscious consent. Conscious consent is you gimme the benefits, you gimme the risks, and you give me an Alternative and 0 (48m 42s): You don't make a 13 year old picket. Right. That's just like, no, 2 (48m 46s): Also make your skin glow. 0 (48m 48s): Oh, I'm sure. My god. That's what they, I swear to you that is like a, this will help you with your acne. It's like, no, you know what will help with their acne is Balancing their hormones. Their hormones are changing. They need more support than they needed the first, you know, 12 or whatever years before they had their period. Now they need more support in different foods to support them turning into a woman and are lazy ass culture instead of understanding and embracing it. And it's supporting like, here's a pill. What? No, not, here's a pill. And your skin is telling you something. If your skin's breaking out, it's telling you something. Stop and listen. Don't throw, throw the kid on whatever. Because usually it's not the, that that doesn't solve it. 0 (49m 28s): Right. We're masking and we're not embracing the Magic of who we are as individuals. It's just easier to put somebody on a pill. 2 (49m 36s): Right. And then we don't believe that food can do anything. And what's really interesting, so they have the Hippocratic oath, right? So I'm gonna mess up his name. But the guy that basically came up with the Hippocratic Oath, it was like hypocrisies or something. It was a, it's Aian name some Greek dude. Right? So he comes up with the Hippocratic oath and it, the part of his, his ideology was Let thy food be thy medicine. So the dude that helped, you know, pioneer medicine didn't discount like the Magic and the Healing of food and what we put into our body and we see that, right? We see that even, 0 (50m 7s): Is it even Magic? It's logical. It's like what do you think your body is recreating itself with the nutrients you put inside of it? That's the only thing it can use. Yeah. Just like any other animal. 2 (50m 18s): Well, not only are we not eating the healthy foods, right? We're taking these medicines that we don't necessarily know what they're doing and then we're eating all of this processed junk and then we're wondering like, why are my H hormones going crazy? Why is my skin going crazy? Yeah. Why do I feel like my brain is working against me? Right. You get like all of this depression that can start coming in because you're not supposed to just be at one Hormone level forever. Right? Yeah. Like I'm pretty like obviously do what you want with your medication. I'm not a doctor, but I would say like look into birth control before you go onto it. 0 (50m 46s): Oh God, yes. Yeah. And look into, I mean I took it like you, I was on birth control before I was married, so I think I started it at like 15 cuz I had horrible periods. And I'm like, oh, those horrible periods were telling me something that I was basically from my point of view, malnourished. And I didn't understand it and I was working myself too hard. And I was, when I look back I'm like, oh, I can see why my body was behaving that way. But no one took the time to really find out what it, oh, just throw on birth control. She won't have nine day periods anymore. And it's like, well yeah, I probably could have fixed that another way because now my periods are four days and it's just like, yes. So really pay attention to any type of medicine you're taking. 0 (51m 27s): I really, it takes a lot for me to think that any of them are worth anything. Because so often it's like, oh, just take this. And I'm like, did you look at the side effects of it? And you think that you have to be so in tune with your body to realize the side effects on you. I mean it's, but we have to, we're our own advocates, you know? And science is fun and science is cool and it's saved a lot of people and I'm grateful for it. But I think that you need to use it very sparingly, you know? 2 (51m 55s): Right. Like you only don't go straight for the sledgehammer. Yeah, 0 (51m 58s): Yeah. Ever, ever. I'm like, oh God, let's not just start cutting body pieces out because I mean, you go to a surgeon, what, what's their job? They're surgeons so something's wrong. Oh, let's just yank it out. And I'm like, let's not, it's probably there for a reason. I mean they were trying to take my uterus out and all of it at 29. Whoa. And I'm like, you know, I'm so thankful that Charles was there to put his foot down. He was just like, I am not comfortable with you doing that. And some people would be like, how dare he, your body, you're whatever. How grateful am I that he, he was willing to, at the risk of me being angry and telling him to mind his own business, say, I'm just not comfortable with you doing that. Thank God I had him. Right. 2 (52m 38s): Yeah. I've had a similar situation. So I have family history of like different kinds of cancer, like whether it's like uterine, cervical, et cetera. And I was doing a checkup and my doctor was like, well we should do that, this really invasive screening and you have to watch this 30 minute video and then we'll do this screening and we'll tell you your likelihood of getting cancer. And at first I was like, oh, well that seems why not? Right? Like I'll, I'll just go in the waiting room and I call my husband and he's like, what are you doing? And I was like, oh, he said to do this. He's like, get the fuck outta the room right now. What are you doing? He's like, you know how important mindset is, and this sounds w look at Jo, Dr. Jodi Ben's work and plenty of other people. 2 (53m 18s): Like whether or not we have like that gene turn on varies so much of our mental state, our environment, like you might have it, but whether or not it is expressed is totally different. So if you put yourself into this situation where you start telling yourself, I'm gonna get sick, I'm gonna get this, this is my story. Like that's a dangerous and dicey game to play. 0 (53m 38s): Yeah. Yeah. You're, we are capable of creating our reality. So it's like, what do you want to create? And I mean if you really think about cancer, you do understand what it is. It's just a mutation. Your body is reproducing a mutation over and over and over. So can we stop that? Can we take out the things that are creating that mutation? I don't know. 2 (54m 1s): Some people have done it. 0 (54m 2s): I know 2 (54m 3s): It's totally done it. 0 (54m 4s): And it's like, you can say woowoo, whatever, but it's like, you know what your body is going to do, what you tell it to do. 2 (54m 11s): Yeah. I mean just look at the placebo effect. Right? Yeah. So that's, again, I've been reading a lot of Joe to, he's awesome lately. I love him. Yes. Cause I have my own like thyroid stuff. I'm trying to like heal right now without medication. And he gives so many examples that like firsthand examples, actual studies, this one man had thought he had an incurable disease and there was this new therapeutic, experimental drug on the market that was supposed to be like a silver bullet. So he's like, sign me up. So he is paying all this money. This is not covered by insurance. And he, the minute he gets injected, he's like, I feel better. He came to life the, whatever the disease was, cause I, I don't know what it was, it might have been cancer. All of a sudden they can't detect it anymore. 2 (54m 52s): Thriving. A few months later an article comes out saying that it was a sham. It's basically just like saline water. And this company got like put out of business obviously for ethical reasons. The moment that he realized that the medicine didn't work, it came back. It came back and 0 (55m 8s): He died. No way. 2 (55m 10s): Yeah. Yeah. And there's all of these examples in dispenses books and they're true stories. So it's like, be very careful with how you use your mind and what you tell your mind to 0 (55m 19s): Tell yourself. Say what you say. Yeah. I'm, I met this girl a few weeks ago and her father had died when she was two from cancer. And she was like, oh, I'm sure I'll die from cancer too. And I was like, I was like, oh, don't say that. Don't like, she's like, oh, I've been saying it forever. And I'm like, you're 16 saying it like you've been telling your body for how many years. This is how we're gonna die. Yeah. So make sure that you produce that. Yeah. And I'm just like, it terrified me. And I'm like, nobody has told her, like my motherly instinct kicked in and I was just like, I just wanted to tell her, don't say that ever again. But it's like, you can't tell somebody that. So I just kind of like listened to her. I tried to take the same approach I would with my kids and I listened to her and I was like, oh, you know how amazing you are. 0 (56m 2s): Right. You create your reality. It's like, I would hate for that to happen. 2 (56m 7s): Yeah. We do that with ours too. Mine always goes, I'm Magic mama, it's fine, I'll heal. And he's like, and I'm more Magic. What did he do? He had like, oh he had chap lips this morning. I was like, let me put something on your lips. He's like, no, no, no, no, no. My body is Magic and it'll fix it. I don't need it and I'm more magical than you so that's why you need chapstick. I 0 (56m 28s): Was like, you're like, Hey, if that makes you feel good, fine. 2 (56m 30s): Yeah. I was like, true. You're probably more tapped in than I am right 0 (56m 33s): Now. I mean, I think the, what we fail to realize is our bodies are so Magic, you know, our hair will produce the right amount of oil. Our skin will produce the right amount of oil for us. But we over wash, we put all these chemicals on ourselves, we do all of these things and then we're like, why doesn't it work? It doesn't work. And it's like, cuz you're messing with it. You know? I mean, just a silly example, when I was a teenager I thought I needed to wash my hair every day. It's disgusting if you don't do wa you know, don't wash your hair every day. And then my hair was oily as shit and I'm like, do you understand the cycle you're creating? The more you wash it, the more it freaks out because it's dry, then it starts overproducing. And so I stopped washing my hair that much and it was cool to see the cycle reverse. 0 (57m 16s): Then my hair started calming down and like obviously I've sh loads of it. So it's like, yeah it's so beautiful now. But that's because I learned to trust that my body knows what to do to maintain it. Right? Instead of me listening to outside things and like, oh my God, you have to do this, you have to put all this stuff on it. It's like, no, you don't. You don't. We all get to make choices. 2 (57m 36s): How long did that take for it to recalibrate? Cuz I've told the same thing to my Girlfriends. I'm like, you need to stop washing cuz they'll complain. You need to stop washing your head every day. So yeah, because you wash it every day, 0 (57m 45s): Right? Like you are creating the problem. Your body isn't doing it. You've kicked it into like high gear of I'm not gonna be able to produce what it, what it needs. And so it goes into overdrive and then every time you wash it, you're queuing it to do it again. So I feel like it was like a month and a half, maybe two. Oh, 2 (58m 1s): So it's a commitment. It was 0 (58m 2s): A commitment. Yeah. And you know what I, I just used while I was like processing through that, I used dry shampoo. 2 (58m 9s): Oh. And it didn't make it the problem worse, 0 (58m 11s): I just would spray it on. But maybe it was because I was determined. So I just was like, and I did it slowly. It was like one day, you know, one day instead of washing it every day, I would wash it every other day and then I would wash it every two days. And now I wash my hair like once a week and I work out. I'm like, it's not gross and it doesn't smell bad. And I'm like, wow, my hair is so healthy. I get compliments on it all the time. I wish I could grow my, I'm like, well if you treat it the way that it needs to be treated, it responds. So I'm not saying it's the answer to everything, but eh, yeah. It worked. 2 (58m 42s): Again, the sled cha hammer analogy, right? Yeah. Just like try to like play with things and realize what you do and don't need and Yeah. Well, 0 (58m 48s): And we're each different too. So it's like we're all different. But I think oftentimes, and we'll just keep going with this silly analogy is I have women will compliment me on my hair and then we'll get into it and I'll talk about what I did and they're like, oh well, but for me it wouldn't work because my hair is so oily And I'm like, you're not even willing to try because my hair was so oily. I'm Persian, come on. We like, sometimes before my period, my skin gets so oily, I'm like, you could fry an egg on my forehead. 2 (59m 14s): Like just sit 0 (59m 15s): Outside. And it's like, it's so greasy and it used to frustrate me and now I'm appreciative. I'm like, that's my skin doing what it, it needs to do and I don't have to freak out about it and put, you know, drying chemicals on there. It's just part of my cycle. It's the same every month. And so I'm just appreciative. I'm like, you know what? That's gonna prevent me from getting so many wrinkles. It's part of it. So appreciating, figuring out what our body's natural is and then being appreciative of the differences between each other and being open to listening. So 2 (59m 46s): Yeah. So with that experience with birth control and having a daughter, how do you plan to navigate that conversation with her in like a nuanced way? 0 (59m 54s): Yeah, we've talked about it already. I mean she's only 12. Yeah. So, and she, one 2 (59m 59s): Year before I started 0 (1h 0m 0s): That. Yeah, I know. So with her, that's not something that I, I want to do. And I think that there's other ways to have safe sex without that. So that, that will be my approach. Granted I have, you know, my ex and his wife also involved and so it's like there's more than just my input. But in the, and then of course the most important to me is her input and just being honest with her about the side effects that I suffered through because of taking it. So I think that's probably how I'll approach it. I haven't had to yet. So I'll let you know how that goes. 2 (1h 0m 32s): Yeah, yeah. I'm really curious. Yeah, 0 (1h 0m 34s): Because 2 (1h 0m 34s): There's obvious consequences for people like that don't know safe sex and like how to navigate that. Cause a lot of parents don't talk about it. So if they make a mistake then obviously having a baby at a very young age has a lot of consequences. Yeah. 0 (1h 0m 46s): Hard 2 (1h 0m 46s): One. It's not to say like babies aren't beautiful. I would have 10 if I could like love babies. But I think that there's like a maturity level and an age that you need to be in order to make sure that you're the parent that you need to be. We talked about this last night. I'm like, I could see the benefit of being a younger parent, like having kids in my twenties. My first, I had at 30, but I would've been a terrible mom. I was, I did not sort out my own shit. I had all of this like just baggage. Just baggage from how I was parented baggage just from life. And I, I just was a very different person. Like I look back and like sheesh, you know, thank God I didn't have kids. But yeah, so I can see like I can see wanting to take the easy way out and be like just like swallow this pill. 2 (1h 1m 27s): But there's like so many other ways to do it. So I use, do you know the Mira app? Have you ever seen that? 0 (1h 1m 32s): I haven't. 2 (1h 1m 32s): It's mostly used for conse, like for trying to conceive. But you can use it to like the reverse. Yeah, exactly where you are. And it's so fascinating, especially if you have irregular periods. Like if you have endometriosis or P C O S, you can kind of see what your body is doing. Cause like you said, not everyone's on a 28 day cycle. Yeah. It just gives you so much more information and I'm like, that is the ultimate agency over your body. Like being able to just like know where you're at eventually you get fine tuned into that. Yeah. And I think that that's a beautiful thing because this is one of your viral videos, but it's when you're on birth control, like you can't detect the pheromones of another person. Yeah. And those pheromones are there for a reason. Yeah. They tell you like good match, bad match. 2 (1h 2m 12s): Yeah. And you end up in terrible relationships. One person duetted your video. I saw it just yesterday and she's like, I was on it it and as soon as I got off I became a lesbian. Yeah, 0 (1h 2m 23s): Yeah. She's 2 (1h 2m 24s): Like, oh my god. I realized I like women. Yeah. 0 (1h 2m 28s): I mean people have had so many comments about that and so much trash talking and I'm like, do you realize the person that I was with was a doctor? Like I just check out his credentials. But it is true. It changes your hormones and it's like, do people not understand that your hormones run your life so take care of them. First of all, you, you can't be, you know 100% you if your hormones aren't good. And so I I, I mean after I got off birth control, the, it shocked me and that's why I started researching it because I'm like, I am not even remotely attracted to my ex. Like not even remotely. And the man that I married is so different. 0 (1h 3m 9s): And I'm like how does that happen? Like what creates that? Right. But I had been on birth control since I was I think 14 or 15 and I met my ex when I was 16. So it's like, oh I didn't even have any business choosing somebody on birth control. It's like your body thinks you're pregnant and argue that all you want. It's, there's so many documented things that you can research on it, 2 (1h 3m 30s): But you pick a more feminine man when you're on birth control. Yeah. 0 (1h 3m 33s): At least for me that was the case and now I'm like oh my god. 2 (1h 3m 36s): Yeah. There's research behind it. Like you can get offended. Nobody wants to hear it but it's there. You pick a more and if you look at my choices, you pick a more feminine man man. 0 (1h 3m 43s): Yeah, yeah. Because your body thinks it's pregnant and it wants someone sweet like sweet and feminine because you're looking for your body unconsciously from your mind is looking for someone to soothe and support you through this time. But that's not usually what we need in a match. We need someone who can protect us, someone who is strong, someone who is in his masculine. For most women, these are generalities. Like we said, there are some women that are super in their masculine and their hu their husband wants to be more in his feminine and that's totally okay. So we're speaking in generalities. 2 (1h 4m 15s): Yeah. And you can also, you can also still protect yourself and be self-sufficient and be independent but allow space for someone to say like, I've got your back. Yeah. Like, let you know what I mean, whatever you need, I've got your back. So like being able to fall into a loving embrace and not have to shoulder the weight of everything is up to me. It's my responsibility. No one is reliable, no one's gonna show up when I need them. So we often feel like we have to choose, like you have to choose to be like the surrendered woman and let the man protect you or you have to be the man and find a man who's gonna be okay with that. Like you can be both. Like you can still have like that, you know, warrior princess within you. Yeah. But like allow space for a man to also be a man. 0 (1h 4m 56s): Yeah. I think that's harmonizing. Yeah. So you have to be cognizant of what energy you are emitting and can you harmonize between the two depending on who you're with and what you want out of that relationship. That's the ultimate. It's like wow, can can you do that? You can. And it's just, it takes effort. You have to understand what energy you're putting out there before you can harness it. Right. So it just takes time. But we're all capable of it. 2 (1h 5m 22s): Yeah. And speaking about hormones and the importance of it, I think for some reason that's, that topic dominates the male space. Like H R T is very popular within like the male communities and women don't realize like we have more Testosterone than we actually have estrogen. But we are just kind of more ruled by estrogen, which is why we talk about it. But there are consequences of having low T in both men and women. But we don't even acknowledge it in women, let alone have a protocol for it. So is that anything that you've like looked into or dived into or dealt with personally? 0 (1h 5m 54s): Yeah. So in God was it two years ago, two or three years ago I was dead. Like I literally felt like I was dying and I would have my period and then normally after my period I would feel great. Oh it's like oh great, we're going the two, two weeks of celebration time, happy time, whatever. But what started happening is I would have like one good day and then I would be in excruciating pain for three or four days after my period. And I was like, something's wrong and I couldn't figure out what was going on. Right. And so I had three MRIs and all of the doctors told me nothing was wrong with me. One of the doctors had the balls to tell me I was aging. 0 (1h 6m 34s): That's what my problem was. And I was like, like that's what it is. It's me aging and And you think I have such slow pain tolerance that I'm coming in for MRIs for aging. It's interesting but okay. And I got so frustrated, none of them tested my blood, none of them tested to see what is really going on with this woman. I mean you run multiple companies, 150 employees but you're an idiot in here complaining about aging symptoms. I'm like, no, I'm in severe pain. And when a woman tells you they're in severe pain, usually it's severe 2 (1h 7m 4s): Because our pain threshold is higher. Massive. But that's not taken into consideration. 0 (1h 7m 8s): I agree with you. And so I ended up going to a doctor who was very eastern and western right. And he muscle tests, I don't know if you know what that is, but he started muscle testing my body to see like where were the incongruencies And he found it right in my pelvis and he was like, what is going on there? Do you have like do you have, you know how they have that birth control that you, I forget what Id Nova ring or ING NuvaRing because I had use that previously but, or an I U D and I was like no, but I had, now I forget the name of it. I had a type of birth control. They, they of course yanked it from the market. I didn't know because it was made out of nickel and people were flipping out, you know their bodies were flipping out from it. 0 (1h 7m 51s): My ears bleed if I wear fake earrings in one day. And I'm like oh. So these were inside of me 10 years and that's what my body was freaking out on and causing the excruciating pain. No doctor even with MRIs found it and it's like they had been recalled almost a decade before. So I had them put in what it was is like they put these things in your fallopian tubes and your fallopian tubes scarred around them so the egg can't come down so you don't have to take hormones. Right. You I thought I was doing the better thing then come to I'm highly allergic to nickel. No one told me nickel was in it. My doctor never even asked. And a year after I had them put in, they got recalled and it completely yanked off the market like a full lawsuits the whole nine yards. 0 (1h 8m 33s): I just never heard about it. No one ever told me, my doctor didn't send me anything. I'm like, oh this is what they get away with. We're like Frankenstein that just tested out on me. So my Testosterone was at an eight. He was like, do you feel dead? And I'm like, no shit. That's why I keep spending all this money. Yes. I feel like the living dead and I know what my body should feel like. So he ended up finding a specialist that all he did was take those out of women. Literally that's all he did. And he was like, I've never seen a woman be able to her body be able to sustain them more than three years. Wow. But what it did was it, my body was on such like overdrive to try to fight it that all of my hormones were just so messed up. My thyroid was crazy, my Testosterone was crazy. 0 (1h 9m 15s): All of it. And it took, I mean I felt so much better almost immediately, but then it took a good year or two for things to build back to healthy. But I knew, I was like, I know there's something wrong. I eat healthy, I work out, I have what should be the perfect body. Right? It's like I should be healthy but this isn't right. So my thing whenever people have issues is like trust your Gut if you're not, if you're feeling like there's something wrong, it probably is. And you have to be your own advocate. 2 (1h 9m 44s): Yeah. Get a blood, like get a panel done, get blood work. Yeah. Because that will at least give you a baseline, like something to look at and see what's kind of out of whack. And really 0 (1h 9m 52s): I think we should be doing that once or twice a year period. Absolutely. 2 (1h 9m 56s): Because 0 (1h 9m 56s): It's, as we change, we're all different. And so my baseline isn't the same as your baseline. And the sooner you have it, you know the more you'll be able to tell if something's off. So, but no one tells you to do those things. 2 (1h 10m 8s): Yeah, it, the medical Establishment is the quickest way to get me riled up because as someone who has like multiple Autoimmune disorders and got like chronically sick at a very young age, like 19, I didn't have a support system at all. I moved away for a university. I was breaking up with a boyfriend. Like I really had no tribe whatsoever. And then you are this young woman going in complaining about X, Y, and z. And I literally had this doctor who she like was very like very arrogant and was like, I graduated from Chapel Hill. Like that was supposed to mean something. Well she told me I was dehydrated. She's like, are you dehydrated? I was like, no I am hydrated. It's not, I'm not fucking dehydrated. 2 (1h 10m 49s): I go back in and like this went on for months. I go back in and I'm like dropping weight, dropping weight like can and I'm eating like a horse. Like I'm waking up to eat cause I'm painfully hungry. And she's like, oh well maybe you're just stressed. Maybe it's mono. I'm like mono. I'm like, what are you talking, did you have a test for that? What do you It's finals week. I go back in and then she thinks I have an eating disorder because every time I go in I'm skinnier and skinnier and I'm like, I'm, if I told you what I ate in a D day, you wouldn't believe me. Yeah. Like I am eating more than like my six foot two, 200 pound boyfriend. Yeah. Like I'm like I, I am. Cause I'm that hungry doesn't put piece anything together. It got so bad. And I'm going to multiple doctors at this point. No one is diagnosing me. 2 (1h 11m 29s): Everyone thinks I'm neurotic. 0 (1h 11m 31s): Isn't that funny how women get classified as, I mean that's what they thought when I went to three different MRIs. 2 (1h 11m 35s): She just wants attention. She's crazy. I would do it in a much more economical way. That was what I wanted. It's 0 (1h 11m 41s): Like dude, I can sit home and throw a fit for this. Like Right. I'm not gonna take in my pajamas 2 (1h 11m 44s): Time and my money and have to deal with insurance and all of this weight in waiting rooms at a gross hospital. All and 0 (1h 11m 50s): Your attitude. Right? 2 (1h 11m 51s): Like I would go about it a different way and then I got to the point where I was 90 pounds. Oh and my resting heart rate, and this is gonna sound fake, was over 200. I 0 (1h 12m 1s): Would 2 (1h 12m 1s): Shut up. I would get to the point where if I sat up I would pass out. I couldn't, my muscles atrophied, I couldn't walk anymore. Like I could walk straight lines, couldn't do stairs at all anymore. Couldn't, I didn't have enough strength to push a gas pedal. That's how weak my muscles were. I go to a janky walk-in clinic here like looks like shit. But I'm like, I need some, I 0 (1h 12m 23s): Need help somebody before I die. 2 (1h 12m 25s): He sends me to the emergency room and he's like, I think you have Graves disease. I think no one caught it. It's just really intense. You need to go to the hospital right now. So he sends me to the hospital and they do like the radioactive treatment and they're like, yes, you have this and like you need to get pumped with these medications to tell your Hormone to like stop. Cause it's going crazy. How the fuck did no one catch it? Dude, I'm so if I was a guy, like, and I hate saying this cause I'm not the type of person that's like men, women we're like at war with each other. But there is enough data out there that women have this happen to them more often than men. And why is that? Like why does no one take us seriously? So yes, to get to the point I guess of this very long story is like be your own advocate because no one else is gonna do it. 0 (1h 13m 7s): Yeah. And when you know that there's something, you just have to keep pushing. I'm sorry, but you do. Yeah. So just like you said, you almost died and that's what it took. But thank God that you were smart enough and trusted yourself that like I'm, I have to keep pushing. Yeah. So I mean it's a, it's an interesting time that we live in that, you know, you have to fight so hard to be heard and I hope that that changes. Yeah, 2 (1h 13m 33s): You do. And the only, 0 (1h 13m 35s): The only way it changes is if we talk about it, talk about it. It's like I'm not, we're not trying to hate on anyone that doesn't have to go through what we ha we went through. But what we're trying to do is expose that it is this way. Like there are women that are suffering and there these things are a big deal. It's not a little thing. Yeah. You know, 2 (1h 13m 52s): And Trusting, your Gut like we've become so disconnected with our intuition and that is a superpower of women. And this, this again is science. You can look it up. The CIA even like uses this to their advantage. Like women are more tapped into, it has to do with like our connection between like our corpus colossal, like that wiry thing that connects our hemisphere. So that's quicker for women. So we're able to kind of like look at things like with a spidey sense and just like know that no we obviously your Gut has like a lot more serotonin and like neurochemicals than we thought before. So it's all connected and like that's where you're like Gut 0 (1h 14m 27s): Shocking. Right? Gut 2 (1h 14m 28s): Instinct comes from but you have it. Yeah. For some reason like we have been kind of trained to tune that down. Like not listen, 0 (1h 14m 35s): Do you 2 (1h 14m 35s): Think that is right? Like believe what you're feeling and like look into it. Like don't just like let people tell you that you're crazy if you feel something like dig a little bit deeper. 0 (1h 14m 44s): Yeah. Yeah. I think, I think what people forget is what's the easiest way to control, it's to make you stupid. Mm. And make you not trust yourself. Like let's stop pretending that there isn't a control thing going on here. There always is and there always has been and there always will be in the world. So it's just like you need to understand that and then you need to understand that it's your job to run your life only yours and you are your own advocate and you can create change. So if you are somewhere that you don't like right now, you are the only one that can take those steps to fixing that. And regardless of who did it wrong, this doctor, that doctor push 'em to the side. 0 (1h 15m 25s): I don't care. I don't care where they went to school, I don't care what their credentials are. I'm sorry. Doesn't mean anything to me. If you can't figure out what my thing is, then we're just not the right match. That's cool. I'm not discrediting you, I'm just saying bye because I know me. I've lived with me. You have lived 2 (1h 15m 40s): With you. Right. And you're allowed to say no. Yeah. I think you're allowed to fire doctors. Oh, people don't know that you can fire a doctor. You know what doctors, I've fired so many. It's great. You should again try that. Try that. I'm like, sorry guys. Amazing. 0 (1h 15m 53s): Sometimes it's, I mean in doctors they're asked to do a lot. It's their job is almost impossible. And so, but there are ones that you can find that truly care. You're not just a number. Right. You know that they're pushing through so they can make a claim on your insurance. There are ones that care and when you find those, keep them. Yes. So it's like, oh. And whenever I find one, it makes me so happy and I, I always write a review so that other try to help other people find them too. So I mean there are good ones out there. You just have to search. 2 (1h 16m 23s): Yeah. So when it comes to, I guess like transitioning into sovereignty and freedom and being unbridled, do you feel, cuz obviously you're an ambitious woman, right? Like you, you're not just like staying at home and there's nothing wrong with that, but like, you're not just staying at home and like being a housewife. Like you also have this amazing brand that you're building and you're an entrepreneur. You're still obviously very soft and feminine at the same time. So how do you balance out, I guess that interdependence with the relationship instead of being co-dependent with a relationship? So like how do you not lose yourself in a Romantic relationship with someone else? And then how do you not also become so independent that there is not that overlap? 0 (1h 17m 4s): Yeah, I mean girl, isn't that the question of the millennia? It's like, wow, I think it's much harder for relationships now than it ever has been before. And I think that that's something that you have to navigate with each person, right? And it's also from my point of view, something that evolves and changes consistently. So if you're not willing to really take the time to look into your relationship and adjust for each other, it's not gonna work. Don't get married. It's hard. I was like, this is not an easy route. You're asking two people that are completely different regardless of what you know your values are and all of that genetically completely different to say, hey, we're gonna make this work. And so to me it's definitely been an evolution with Charles. 0 (1h 17m 48s): And I mean after 12 years we've gone through a lot of evolving I feel like. But it's probably the number one thing I think is being able to give grace to each other and remember that like, I want this person to be happy. That's what I care most about. Whether it's happy with me or not. Right? If you truly love someone, then you can say that. And I know I've had people be like, oh, you guys this or that, and it's like, I really don't care what you think because I know that I truly love that man more than, I mean, I think that he showed me what true love was and it's not controlling someone, it's not having someone by your side. It's that I love you so much that I'm gonna support you in what makes you happy and joyful. 0 (1h 18m 32s): Whether or not that works for me sometimes. Right. So it's willing to, to put the other person's joy and happiness above yours momentarily and not lose the fact that you still have to prioritize yours. So I think that ebbs and flows at times, right? Because you're both giving and taking. So I don't know if that answered your question, but I think it's just being okay with understanding that it's not always 50 50. Sometimes I give 80, sometimes he gives 20, sometimes he gives 99 and I'm only able to give one. Right. And I, we had a funny conversation the other day and I was just like, look, the PMs week, I cannot physically carry the emotional weight of our relationship the other weeks of the month. 0 (1h 19m 18s): I'm stellar at it because he has very low eq, very high iq. And I have very high eq, eq. So it's easy for me usually to balance and manage that. But I have learned over time that that week I'm tired, right? I need all of my energy to be focused on Alicia. So if our relationship needs support, I'm gonna need you to do it then. And he was like, wow, you've never said it that way before, but I get it. I was like, wow, this takes communication. 2 (1h 19m 46s): That's kind of like the answer to everything when it comes to relationship is communication. Yeah. And that I think the part that a lot of people miss out, including myself, is the act of listening and not just like I know exactly what I'm gonna say to prove my point, but the act of listening and then offering the safe space for them to be honest and vulnerable and then problem solve. It's like, what is the goal of this, this conversation? Is it to end up together and to fix and heal? What's, you know, what, what needs mending or is it to prove a point and say that I was right or to make you feel like shit or point out your flaws or your mistakes. So you kind of have to navigate it through that perspective, 0 (1h 20m 21s): That lens of we're a team, right? Like for real, we're a team. So it's not about what's right or wrong, it's about what gets the team to the end goal, right? Yeah. I think that's a hard one. Or at least it was for me to really believe that we were a team and I'm like, are we really? Or hmm. You know? And so really truly accepting that and then being willing to say, you know what? I'm gonna trust that we are because that's the commitment we made to each other until you show me something different. So that's still leaving the space for you to let them prove what team means to them too, right? So we're not saying just be abused. It's like, no, be cognizant of everything that's going on, but be a team player. 2 (1h 21m 3s): Yeah. One of what piece of advice I got that I always tried to remember and not always like I'm obviously not perfect, is to always assume the best out of your partner. Yeah. So when something happens that ticks you off that you're like, okay, well if I'm assuming the best out of him right now, like what is the reason that this thing happened? And then it can easily get you in a place where you can calm down and it's u in my case, it's usually right. So my husband has pretty bad a d d and he does a lot to mitigate it. Like he does a ton of meditating and introspective work and very rarely does he take an any medication for it. So he's like trying to, you know, kind of contain it himself. And there are times where he is a lot more present than others and then there is times where he's not. 2 (1h 21m 43s): And one of my biggest pet peeves is like repeating myself or feeling like I'm not heard. 0 (1h 21m 49s): Yeah. 2 (1h 21m 50s): And I'll say something and if, if I'm in a good place, I can like breathe and pause and I'm like, he'll come back in like 10 seconds and I'll be like, oh, where were you babe? You know? Yeah. Like what, what were you thinking about? Like what were you dreaming about? And then you like playful and it's fine. And there's other times where I am, you know, have a short fuse and I'm not having a good day and I'm not like to the standard standard that I wanna be at. And I'm like, what the fuck hear me? How dare you never listened to me. You know, the Gottman's test and have predictability for relationships as being acknowledged. Yeah. Just acknowledge me. Yeah. and all these things. And he's just like, oh my gosh. He saw, he's like, did you not see that I just came in or I was like sending, finishing a text or an email. 2 (1h 22m 31s): Like there's maybe something I didn't notice that was a signal to like pause and wait for him to be in a p a position to be receptive to my question. Yeah. Not all about me. Like I'm not on my phone. So you need to be paying attention to me right now. Isn't 0 (1h 22m 43s): It funny how that's how we are? It's like I'm talking so the world stops. Yeah. I know I got burned alive for this one. But something that works for Charles and I is when I want to speak to him, I just ask, Hey babe, is now a convenient time? I probably need two or three minutes from you for this topic. And you're like, oh my god, that's so businessy. And I'm like, oh my God, we don't fight that way. And he listens. So whatever, whatever works for you. Because For men, it's about convenience for women, it's about comfortability. So when he comes to ask me for something, he asks if it's a comfortable time. And I'm just like, I think it's so sweet. And it's just like, Hey dude, we all have so many things going on in our heads. Like I might look like I'm doing nothing, but I'm thinking a million things. 0 (1h 23m 23s): So if you want to connect, prioritize that by asking is now a good time? It's common courtesy. Like I think we forget it because it's, it's so common to be together, right? So we forget that this is another person, we're not connected. Yeah. You know? And so common courtesy still applies. 2 (1h 23m 43s): We don't give that to our partners. No. We sometimes, and I say we, I should speak for myself. 0 (1h 23m 48s): I'll agree with you. Cause me too, I know I'm 2 (1h 23m 51s): Guilty. I don't, I do not offer that to Eric a lot. Like there are times where I'm way more demanding and way more cold or abrasive than I would be with almost anyone else. Because you feel safe, so comfortable. Yeah. So I guess, yeah, like at least I feel safe, but he doesn't deserve that. So it's also being like, how would I treat anyone else in this position? Like, don't let yourself get too comfortable to where you're not treating your partner how they deserve to be treated. 0 (1h 24m 14s): Yeah. Yeah. It's, they say that kids do this too. Right? So they save their worst behavior for their parent. They do. Yeah. They do. They do. 2 (1h 24m 20s): That's, 0 (1h 24m 21s): That's so it's like, it's a huge compliment because it means they feel safe with you, with everyone else they bottle. Okay. Right. Okay. So that I have to be on my best behavior or my teacher will be upset with me, my or my friends won't like me or this or that. And so the way that children do it is that all of that saves up all day. And then when they see mommy, it's like, like throw up the feelings on you because they know you love them. And so it's like, hey, we, we as adults still sometimes behave that 2 (1h 24m 46s): Way. I've had so many moms ask me that question, so I'm gonna have to share that clip with them. 0 (1h 24m 50s): That's not my knowledge that somebody, some psychologist told me this. 2 (1h 24m 53s): Oh, that's, 0 (1h 24m 54s): Here's 2 (1h 24m 55s): That mind. I'm just sharing information. Like there's a difference between like bootlegging someone else's ideas and then also just like being a person that has acquired information from so many places. And then if you wanna get really spiritual with it, it's like, well, whose information is that? Really? 0 (1h 25m 8s): I agree with you. It's like, it's all, 2 (1h 25m 9s): It's a good, it's a download, right? Yeah. Like all information ev that ever was, is or going to be is present. Sure. Right? Yeah. And you're tapping into it. And again, if you wanna go on a rabbit hole, if you look at really massive inventions throughout history, they've been invented like the same day in different continents when before we had phones or ways of communicating. 0 (1h 25m 28s): Isn't it crazy? 2 (1h 25m 29s): Like why is, you know, why is that happening? It's because there are these downloads and it's like if you intentionally, 0 (1h 25m 34s): You're open to Receiving, right? 2 (1h 25m 35s): Be. Open to Receiving. But like an exercise would be like, try to consciously think of something right now. Like, okay, well why, why did you pick car? Why did you pick a color? Why did, like where did that come from? Sit with that. You don't, you are not gonna come up with an answer. Yeah. And if you are, please tell me. I'm curious. 0 (1h 25m 49s): Yeah. 2 (1h 25m 50s): So yeah, don't, don't discount your own credit. Yeah. But you've accumulated through your life and yeah, I think, you know, give props where they belong but also take your own credit girl. 0 (1h 26m 1s): Oh thank you. I appreciate that. I just, just remember hearing it and when I heard it, I think my children were young and I was like, oh, that makes sense. And the only reason it's important for moms to know is because then when they're acting like little shits, you can be like, that's because he loves me. Like, okay, you feel comfortable. And then of course you have to teach them like, hey, I understand you need to unload your feelings. Something I love and I learned it from one of my Girlfriends, it's called holding the trash can. So basically you have all of these feelings that build up during the day or build up over days. However, you know, long it's been, but it's like sometimes you just have to let them out. And when you let them out, they lose this power when they're, when you keep them inside, it's like they build on each other and they multiply and it's so horrible. 0 (1h 26m 46s): And it's like, oh, if you just let it out, all of it kind of just dissipates. So we just call it holding the trashcan. So put your trash in there, go ahead and even your kids can do that with you, mom, I just need you. They don't need a solution, they just need to get it out. And it's like, oh, I, I understand that feeling. 2 (1h 27m 1s): Yeah. There's a couple Exercises that I do if I'm having a really bad Parenting day, like where I just feel very overwhelmed. So one of them, I think it's this Marcus Aurelius exercise and I discovered it when my first son was only a few months old, thank God. Because I still do it every single night. Like there's not been a night that I haven't done this mental exercise excited. Even when I'm in a good place. Like it's just something that kind of guides me in like my principles of how I want a mother. It's every single night when you lay your child to bed and however that is, like, obviously you're not gonna do bedtime every single night, but like, however, like that last touchpoint is with you, you behave in a way that they will not survive the night. And I can't, like I say that even now and I get emotional because like I feel that and like I understand like the vulnerability of life and not being able to predict when something might happen, right? 2 (1h 27m 50s): Like you hear horrible stories, you know? So it's no matter how bad your day is, like make sure that when you have that last touch point that it is where you want it to be. And your best is gonna be different every single day. Like sometimes it's gonna be rushed and it's like, I love you, but like I need my to go take a minute. Right? It's like I don't, it's not, you don't deserve from that version of me to show up right now. Cause I don't have the patience. So like yeah, it's gonna be quick. And then there's other times where you have like an hour bedtime and you're just both just like loving into it. So that's one of the pieces. And then the other one is you're having a hard day is to pretend that for the day, your 80 year old self, your 90 year old self got the privilege to time travel back to this moment only once, only for this 24 hours. 2 (1h 28m 34s): And it's like, okay, if you think about it that way, my kid could be writing all over the wall and throwing the food on the floor and it could be like just a day of chaos and how fucking beautiful is that? What a gift. Because at that point, you know, my kid's gonna be in his sixties or seventies and he's, I'm probably longing for that squishy toddler. So just like the power of reframing things. Yeah. 0 (1h 28m 58s): Perspective. Yeah. It's like, oh yeah, I mean cuz cuz I'm listening to your stories about your kids and I'm like, hmm, I remember. You know? And it's sweet and it goes by so quick. It doesn't feel like it in the moment, but it will be gone before you know it. Yeah. 2 (1h 29m 13s): So those Different Stages of Motherhood and the way that I describe it, obviously I'm very, I'm in the beginning Stages of it, but already I feel like it's this balance between being so excited to welcome the new child that you're getting and then also this deep morning for this kid that you didn't get to say goodbye to. So I didn't get to say goodbye to the newborn version of either of my kids. Like all of a sudden I blink and like, whoa, they're a baby. And then I didn't get to say goodbye to the baby of my oldest. Like whoa, he's a toddler. Yeah. And right now I'm like just trying to be hyper aware. I'm like, we are on the cusp of toddler and little kid and I don't know what day it is, but I'm gonna wake up and he's gonna be a little kid. 2 (1h 29m 58s): Yeah. You know what I mean? And there's never that day where you realize you're, this is the last day that he's gonna be a toddler or this is the last bubble bath I'm gonna draw. This is the last time that I'm gonna scoop him up into my arms because it happens. So it's like, how do you, 0 (1h 30m 13s): Don't worry, there's never a last time that you're gonna scoop him up in your arms. I still do it to my son and he is like, mom and he'll like scoop me up and I'm like, I don't care. I have to try. He's bigger than I am. And it's just like, I don't care. You're still my son. So it's just like, but yeah, I know what you're saying. 2 (1h 30m 28s): Yeah. Like navigate, like just navigating that. Yeah. And then not falling into the trap of like, are you familiar with Carl? Young's? Devouring. Mother. Archetype. So there's this little short, it's by Disney, it's called Bao and it's only like six minutes long. I highly recommend, especially moms watch this, it's a really good visualization of that Archetype. So it's this mom that through good intention, right, through pure love and the need to protect and like that biological urge to protect and like shield and consume ends up overprotecting the child. Okay. So quite literally like the mom in the movie like eats the baby. Oh, okay. 2 (1h 31m 8s): And it's so important, especially for moms of boys to be able to let them step into their manhood. Right. There's in controversial authors, Robert Bly and Hero Iron John, which was sensational back in like I think the sixties or seventies. And the feminists hate it. My husband's reading it now and loves it and I've like seen like little paragraphs here and there that he's sharing with me. And there's this adage in the book that the, the secret to a man's manhood and Masculinity lies in the key that's under the mother's pillow. Oh. So it's, you have to give your son that key to unlock the wild man or the inner like beast. 2 (1h 31m 50s): And then he has to learn to tame it. Yeah. Right. That's his responsibility to get control of that. But if you never let him out of that cage to experience it, then you're robbing him of something very 0 (1h 32m 1s): Vital. Yeah, yeah. Oh that's beautiful. And then in the same regard, I think that For men, it's offering the safe space for their daughters to be vulnerable and to learn that it's okay like the their, their potential spouse or you know, all of that, that men can be trusted to protect you. Men can be there to be that stable for you. But all of that comes from, you know, their first male relationship. Just like with the boys, it's their mom. So we have these opportunities to really give these gifts to our children. But you have to be cognizant 2 (1h 32m 32s): That modeling is huge. Yeah. They say that a dad, and it's probably the same for both, but that a dad is the first representation of unconditional love to the daughter. Yeah. So then she kind of knows what to go look for in a partner moving forward. Like what does safety security like, like that safe harbor look like? What should I go and try and find? And so many women are robbed of that relationship. So then they are left wandering and then end up picking mates that are probably not the best ones for them. 0 (1h 32m 56s): Yeah, I agree with that. 2 (1h 32m 58s): Yeah. Oh my gosh, I had something that I wanted to go. Oh, so speaking about like that kind of relationship between like mothers and sons and fathers and daughters and like, just like that polarity between like the masculine and feminine, obviously we have both. And like which one steers you as so independent to who you are as an individual when it comes to creating like a safe space for women to feel safe? There's this exercise that's kind of going around at certain retreats right now, certain Workshops, it's getting really sensationalized on social media and I'm, I'm sure I'm, we'd be shocked if you haven't, haven't seen it. So essentially I haven't done one, so like full disclosure, like maybe there's a ton of context that I don't have and maybe that would change my mind. 2 (1h 33m 40s): And I'm always open to that. So like, if you have it, please let me know. Like, I won't be offended, I just wanna learn. But from what I've seen is there is this circle that's created of women and around them are the men. And then the men end up bowing to the women. Oh, 0 (1h 33m 56s): I've heard about those. 2 (1h 33m 56s): Have you? Have you seen 0 (1h 33m 57s): It? No, I just heard about it. 2 (1h 33m 58s): Yeah. So I will put, add a little clip. 0 (1h 34m 0s): Marcus, did he do, did he, I feel like he posted something about this. 2 (1h 34m 4s): So my, we were at that retreat, I left early, my husband was there and he has his own perspective. So I guess if he ever wants to share it, he can. The short is like he didn't agree with it and he, and he interesting. And he experienced it. So like, okay, I know there's context that I don't have and again open to hearing it, but my husband who did participate, op, and he is the most open minded minded person you'll ever meet. So he went into it like, I wanna learn and observe this. Yeah. What's going on here is about, yeah. So I wanna experience it before I have an opinion. So he did it. I told him I didn't want him to do, I found out the exercise was happening. I'm like, I will never tell you what to do. Like you are your own person. I would like you to not do this exercise. And I gave him my reasoning and 0 (1h 34m 41s): Then he 2 (1h 34m 42s): Still did it and he still did it. And you were okay. And I'm okay. You didn't, it wasn't a fight. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't a fight at all. I was just like expressing like my, my honesty, like my perspective and Can 0 (1h 34m 51s): You share that? I'm curious. 2 (1h 34m 51s): Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, and, and he was like, well, I just don't know. Like, again, again, so open-minded that he went in with zero judgment where I obviously I have my judgment or your intuition. Or my intuition, right? Yeah. Right. Except to be judgment. Yeah. Thank you for that. Yeah. Thank you for that reframe. Beautiful. Yeah. My perspective or my intuition or judgment around this situation, and this is coming from someone who didn't have that safe harbor. My dad left at a very young age. I never talked to him again. I felt like, why am I not lovable? There was abuse. Like I pretty much had one of the worst relationships you could have with like that man that's supposed to provide you an example of unconditional love or safety. Right? Like quite literally the man that brought me into the world was physically abusive. 2 (1h 35m 33s): So what does that tell me about my, my safety going out into the world? Yeah. And I've done my own work with that. And I feel very safe around men now. And I have for a long time. So even if I go back to my more wounded self, my younger self, I have that perspective. And then I have the healed version now that is also the mother of two boys. So I have that perspective. So I like kind of both para, like both opposing parallels here. I think for me, what makes me feel safe is a man who is fully embracing his masculine, who doesn't feel that he needs to make himself smaller for me to make myself feel safe, that doesn't have to compromise his self in order to provide room for me. 2 (1h 36m 16s): What makes me feel safe is like a warm embrace or someone who's just standing there fucking sturdy as a rock. Like I always think of my husband, like he is un like he is unwavering. Like you can throw anything at him and he will show up for you. Like, that man is just dedicated and that's what makes me feel safe, but doesn't make me feel safe as like a man who's tiptoeing and retroactively apologizing for like the harm that maybe the masculine has done or the quote patriarchy has done. That doesn't make me feel safe. That makes me feel like if I can make you bend, bend the knee, then what else is gonna, like what's gonna happen when something real comes and rocks you? Yeah. Like I, I can't have confidence that you're gonna show up. 2 (1h 36m 59s): And then also that's taking the work off of me. It's my job to make myself feel safe. No one else can do that. Right. Like there's obviously situational stuff like dark alleys, et cetera. Yeah. Right, right. But like that core feeling, like that neutral of safe, like is my body constantly contracting? Like this is something that I've had to work with. Like I'm constantly in a keel. My root chakra is like always telling me, you are not safe. So there's still work to be done, but like, again, like that's an internal thing that has nothing to do. We're podcasting. Yeah. And I'm like keeling right now. Why? Why? Why do I feel like I need to be contracted And like, you know, there's obviously years of experience that tells my body this is the way that you behave. But no man bending at my feet right now is gonna make me relax. 2 (1h 37m 41s): Yeah. You know what I mean? So I want a man to again like unlock that that wild man and that beast and tame it. That makes me feel safe. Yeah. What's your opinion? I agree. Ooh, I love that. I forget what kicked that off for you. Like basically the, the idea of of men, we 0 (1h 37m 59s): Didn't finish the story. Oh. I'm like, wait, no, no, no, no. I didn't hear the story. Oh, oh, oh, I'll talk. But first I want the story. 2 (1h 38m 4s): So that's my opinion of the exercise. Of the exercise. So like the women will stand there and 0 (1h 38m 10s): What are they doing? 2 (1h 38m 11s): Receiving Gratitude. 0 (1h 38m 13s): I feel like that's what I heard on the clip. 2 (1h 38m 15s): It could be gra I, and again, I wasn't there. My interpretation was that there were a series of questions. Okay. And it was almost like, like however way you had been wronged in the past by the masculine or meant to feel unsafe by the masculine. It was these men stepping in to be there to help you feel healed and safe and seen and by like surrendering to the Divine feminine, being able to embrace like Gaia and that energy. But that seems like a very powerful, potent tool. And not everyone is probably at the place to receive that, the way that it's meant to be. 2 (1h 38m 57s): Have you ever recommended a book to someone that you just, and 0 (1h 38m 59s): They 2 (1h 38m 59s): Weren't ready for it? Yeah. And then they took it and you're like, did we just read two different books? Because that's not, that's not what it meant. And it actually makes the problem worse. Yeah. I feel like that's the same with whether it's a psychedelic or whether it's like some really spiritual tool like this. I think in the right container with the right and very specific vetting and pairing. Like are you doing that with husbands and 0 (1h 39m 19s): Wives and vetting and pairing? I think you hit the, 2 (1h 39m 21s): You could just like randomly pair people cuz what if, what if you had a man that had a very feminist mom growing up who kind of always blamed the man, the masculine men have it easier. You are the reason that I don't have the rights that I do. Like women have it so much harder. Like, you know, just the blaming, like the sex blaming. So he's not allowed to step into his Masculinity. He goes to one of these retreats to try to find it and now you have him bending, like bending the knee like you're now he's gonna hate women. 0 (1h 39m 51s): What was your husband's response to it? So he did it. First of all, can I ask why didn't you want him to do it? What was your intuition kicking in and telling you? And then what was his understanding of it after? 2 (1h 40m 3s): So my reason that I didn't want him to do it was I pictured two boys there like my sons. And I don't think that unless they had done something wrong to this woman that they're trying to heal. Unless that relationship is already there. That retroactively or apologizing or trying to heal something that you didn't partake in. I don't think that sounds sends a good message. It's almost like it kind of perpetuates like a lot of this woke stuff that he seemingly is supposed to be against. Right. Which is like collective guilt, collective apologies, retroactive apologies. I wasn't there. My boys didn't do anything like they haven't been misogynist or like they're not part of the patriarchy. 2 (1h 40m 46s): Like all of these things that we're trying to say are making women feel unsafe. So I just don't understand the Apology aspect for it. And, and again I don't, I don't get a man, I think when you, a man gets on a knee, like when does that happen In our culture? It's to propose. Yeah. It's to propose love to somebody. I think that that is like a pretty big signal and to just kind of throw that out, Lucy goosey doesn't make sense to me either. And it's, is that person that you're bending to in a place to receive it in the healthiest way? Or are you exacerbating the problem of women that are in their masculine that don't know it and you're perpetuating that cycle. Like she just dominated a man. I'm literally domineering over you in this position. 2 (1h 41m 28s): Right. I don't need that. That makes me feel like I have to be the protector that no one's gonna show up. I need someone to let me feel vulnerable and small. And there's this some, there's this thing that one of my like spiritual teachers told me the other day and it, it just resonates with me specifically cuz that was me. I was always like defending myself and I had to be the masculine and like I've got this, I will domineer is, you are so protected, especially as a woman in your vulnerability, think about a newborn baby. They're protected in their vulnerability. They, everyone knows like how delicate they are. So we just show up for them. Yeah. We show up for them because we, they, we know that that's where they're at and what they need. 2 (1h 42m 9s): And like I like it gives me a purpose, like duty responsibility, like love it gets me excited to be able to like be the caregiver and like so many men are like that too. They wanna show up for us. So if you allow yourself to be in that vulnerable position, then you're now allowing someone to take care of you. And now he lights up cuz he's like, I get to take care of 0 (1h 42m 29s): You. And that's hard. It can be hard to do that. 2 (1h 42m 31s): Yeah. Yes. So I was like, it's, it goes against everything that I believe. I feel like we have so many women that need like need and want to be vulnerable. Yeah. They just don't know how. Yeah. And we have so many men that want to step into Masculinity and they don't know how. And when you have this exercise that's quite literally almost exacerbating that problem, like I don't understand. So that was my reason. And like I was just like, I just, and you 0 (1h 42m 54s): Explained that to your husband? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then he was like, I'm still gonna 2 (1h 42m 56s): Do it. And he's like, I understand. Thank you for sharing. Yeah. He like he did. Yeah. And he's like, but I'm gonna make a decision when the, the time comes when Yeah. When the time comes and I'll make whatever decision I feel is right and I'll let you know. Yeah. So he goes to do the 0 (1h 43m 11s): Exercise. What beautiful relationship and exercise right there. I'm just like, and that is the way it's done ladies and gentlemen. 2 (1h 43m 16s): Right. Cuz he, I'm not his mom. Exactly. I will never tell him what to do. Yeah. I don't wanna be his mom. That's the quickest way to dry up that relationship. Yeah. You will never wanna take me to bed literally dry up. I don't wanna take him to bed. Like don't do that. Don't do that. Anyone listening. But yeah, so he does the exercise. I guess he got paired with an older woman who he just was she, he said she was very sweet and he's like, I, what he saw in the moment was an older version of me and like one of our boys or you know, like that kind of dynamic. Yeah. And like that happening. And I don't know why I like still haven't really talked at depth with him about the exercise, but I let him talk and I was like, okay, well like that's your perspective. 2 (1h 43m 56s): And you know, at the end of it he disagreed. He's like, it just, I saw certain people taking it in. Maybe not the best way, like how they processed it but Yeah. I was like I wouldn't, I don't want my boys to ever Bao down to me. 0 (1h 44m 9s): Yeah, no, no. That's interesting. The clip that I saw, I feel like if I remember correctly, portrayed it as a group of women, not a one-on-one. To me that almost makes it even, I'm like whoa. That's, if they were spouses, he, my spouse might be able to heal a wound that my father created because he is in, I have a, you don't allow your father into that space with you. You are born into that. Your father has that right as your father to be in that vulnerable space with you. And some fathers unfortunately knowingly or unknowingly abuse that. Right. And I, I want to believe that most of 'em it's unconscious. Right. 0 (1h 44m 50s): Unconsciously want to hurt you but he's, your father is given that right at your birth and then your husband is given that Right. As a chosen. So I could see that your husband might be able to heal, you know, something for you. But I don't think I would feel comfortable with another man in that exercise anyway. So very intriguing. Yeah. Because the way that I viewed it, I saw it as a group exercise is what I thought. There 2 (1h 45m 11s): Is a group of people but you are 0 (1h 45m 13s): Paired 2 (1h 45m 13s): On one, 0 (1h 45m 14s): One person. Interesting. Yeah. Also just totally like out there but energetically what are we doing here? Like what are the energetics behind that exercise? The ongoing effects of it too. Right. That's like this, just like you said, that is a very, 2 (1h 45m 30s): How's that integrating? Yeah. Do you have follow ups? Yeah. To help people process that. 0 (1h 45m 35s): Not just that it's like between these two people that I've never met we're creating a pretty big representation. So there's energy behind everything. What was that energetic there? I'm really curious. I'm like, oh man. 2 (1h 45m 48s): Yeah. I'll have to ask. I yeah cuz again, like I didn't get to experience it firsthand. I just got the snapshot of what he shared so far. But, 0 (1h 45m 55s): And because your husband is so like interested in these things, I would be very curious if he has felt any lasting impact himself because it was supposed to be for the woman. Right. But the man gave, there was a huge give there. Yeah. So then what, what has come of that? I'm very curious 2 (1h 46m 12s): I think to touch on like the, that Healing Aspect Between, the Two. Divine Energies. It's for the Healing like my Healing, my father wounds cuz like, and they're still there. Like if I talk about it at depth, like I'll probably still cry and then that says that there's a wound that's still being touched. And I'd be lying if I said if that's ever gonna go away. I mean I have two beautiful children and it's like I have this like the original man in my life that wants nothing to do with anyone and that's heartbreaking. You know what I mean? Like that's really heartbreaking. And I spent so much of my life finding men that were either like, like him that were, you know, kind of abusive in one way or another or the exact opposite and like very soft and feminine and like that's not what I'm attracted to. 2 (1h 46m 57s): But they can never hurt me. What healed it for me. Isn't my husband ever going groveling at my feet? Cause he's not that kind of man. He would never do like, he would never do that. But it's like him just showing up, him being that rock, being that 0 (1h 47m 12s): Masculine over and over and over and over again, over again. Stability. 2 (1h 47m 15s): How he parents, how vulnerable he is. Not by making himself small by like setting healthy boundaries by sharing how he feels, by tapping into like his heart center. Like by protecting me in whatever way. Like whether it's like just even my energy, you know, like protecting that but like showing up, like being that pillar. Yeah. Being strong seen and like big. Yeah. So it's kind of the opposite. And then for him, he's going through a lot of Healing mother wounds. Yeah. And Healing kind of like that feminist kind of like masculine, domineering Archetype for him. And I think that for him, and I can't, I can't speak for him, this is just like my perspective of obviously everything, but the more that I lean into my feminine and softness and surrender, like that's being healed. 2 (1h 48m 3s): Him seeing me mother versus how he was mothered. It's 0 (1h 48m 6s): Exactly what I was thinking. Yeah. And for you, some of the Healing for your father might come from your sons. 2 (1h 48m 11s): Oh wow. I didn't think of that. Yeah. 0 (1h 48m 14s): I know that in my journey with my kids, I feel like they have been the greatest teachers and I think that's why I, I parent them the way that I do because I'm like, the amount of blessings that you guys have given me is they don't even have to understand it. And, and I think that if we're open to that, like they're here to teach us so much, we so frequently get it wrong. It's like, oh I'm gonna teach please. Your job is to protect them. Right. The real gift is what they bring and teach you. 2 (1h 48m 45s): Yeah. I feel like with each one they've cracked me open a little bit more. Yeah. And I was like whoa, I'm just so much more gushy and like I feel 0 (1h 48m 53s): More wait till they're teenagers and you're just like, oh my god. And even you getting to watch your husband love them. I think that that too. 2 (1h 49m 1s): That's massively Healing. Yes. I'm like this is a dad, this is a man. Beautiful. Right. Like that can exist. And if I was in this place of blame, which works still in like this war of the sexes, I wouldn't see that and I probably wouldn't have him. So it's like what are you really gaining from blaming the opposite sex or partaking in this, this or that or we're at odds with each other instead of seeing what a beautiful compliment we're supposed to be. 0 (1h 49m 24s): Yeah. Also I think remembering that and you, this saying is forgiving, but the hand that gives isn't always the same hand that you receive from this also goes for wounds. So the hand that gave you the wound might not be the one to give you the Healing. So just remembering and being open to that I think is really important that, you know, it's a lot of times we're like, you hurt me so you fix it. It's like that's not how it works. You hurt me and I learned thank you for that experience and someone else is being brought into your life to help you heal. Right? The right person, the right child, the right friend, the right husband, the right, the universe is bringing it to you. 2 (1h 50m 5s): Now you've been pretty open about your mission, which is like connection and Enlightenment. Unless that's changed. Cause obviously things change. They do. But I think it's like a beau, that's a beautiful mission. Thank you. I don't think you can do much better than those two things on your path to Enlightenment. I think with a lot of that content, we talk a lot about Healing and like trauma and things like that. Two things that I'd love your perspective on are how do you get into a place where you are open to Healing, like you're able to heal and forgive and like really embody that. And then how do you avoid the trap of perpetually Needing Healing? 0 (1h 50m 44s): Hmm. That's interesting. I, I love that. So being willing to forgive, I think for me it hit me that I'm hurting myself by not forgiving. I'm not hurting the other person. The hand that dealt that pain, me hating and unfor, they're not Receiving that. So it's like what are you doing? You're just hurting yourself more by being unwilling to forgive that. And just because you forgive something doesn't make what happened. Okay. You're not justifying or allowing that to happen. Again. I forgave and now I have learned and I have different boundaries. Not for that person. I have a different boundary for myself because I can't control that person. 0 (1h 51m 24s): They might do the same thing again, but they won't get the same response from me because I've learned. And so in order to really, I think learn that lesson, you have to be willing to forgive first because if you're still in hatred and blame and victim mentality, you can't grow. So it's like, first I have to allow that to process. So giving yourself the space to process that and and really let it go and being willing to do it multiple times, some hurts. Take a lot of forgiveness over and over. You're like, haven't I already done this? And it's like, well maybe you have, but now obviously you need to do it again. Just like you said, if I really talk about this topic, I'm gonna cry. And there have been many things in my life where I felt like that. 0 (1h 52m 6s): And thankfully now I sometimes I like to check in with those things. Like, okay, how do I feel about that now? Like, can I talk about it now? And so I think it's an important part. And honestly as I progressed down that path of forgiveness, what I really came to, and this is gonna sound so woo, but, and I don't even know if it's right, it just works for me. Well, we've 2 (1h 52m 27s): Got crystals and bacon Buddhas, so neat. 0 (1h 52m 29s): Rub ball. I'm like, I really don't feel like I have to forgive others anymore. Who am I to forgive you? Come on man. We're all on a journey. That doesn't mean that I just don't think it's really necessary. I used to, I used to feel like until that person apologizes, I can't forgive them because I, they need to learn their lesson and I would be letting them, you know, overstep boundaries and da da. And now I'm like, that has nothing to do with anything. They are being who they are and they're in that part of their journey. and all I can do is accept them for who they are and create new boundaries. 2 (1h 53m 4s): So it sounds like you've even almost like transcended the idea of forgiveness. Not like I know. Not like I don't need to forgive. I'm gonna hold onto a grudge. Like it's, there is no forgiveness because there is no wrong, there's, I haven't been wrong, 0 (1h 53m 17s): You haven't wronged me. And I know that sounds so crazy, but I'm just like, I don't need to forgive anymore. It used to be such a big thing, like you have to acknowledge that you have wronged me and now I'm just like, I don't care. I don't care. Because now I look at your behavior and I'm like, do I want to continue with this? Do I want to still be here with you as you behave this way? Or am I gonna create a new boundary for me? And me creating that new boundary does not mean I have to tell you I've created it. You are not allowed to treat me this way and an Apology. No, no, no. I just observe you. I see how your actions make me feel. If I think there needs to be clarification cuz this isn't the way you normally behave, then I will do that. 0 (1h 53m 57s): Or if you've shown me over and over, this is how you're gonna behave and not change, then I have to set up a boundary for myself that when this then that it's very simple and therefore I don't have to forgive you. If you're still abusing that, then I need to look at myself. Yeah. Because it's like, whoa, I'm allowing this. It's not you, it's me. Right. We don't think about forgiving our dog every time they bark, even though we don't like it. Right? Yeah. It's like, okay, well I'm either gonna accept that that's who you are. I'm gonna put a shot collar on you or I'm gonna, you know, there's only so many different things you can do and then you can decide you don't wanna have a dog. Right? Yeah. So I know it sounds 2 (1h 54m 33s): Sometimes that's where I'm at. Yeah. 0 (1h 54m 35s): Well I think we all hit that at different, different things in our lives. Yeah. But yeah, I don't feel like it's necessary anymore. Hmm. And now all the gurus Go ahead. My god knows what kind of post you'll get on this one. But that's how I feel. 2 (1h 54m 48s): No, it's like that's a really, I haven't heard anyone think that because I do, I think a lot of people get caught in the trap of thinking that they need the direct Apology from whoever was like the perpetrator. Yeah. No you do not. You can do these Exercises by yourself and you know it's 0 (1h 55m 1s): Not about them. No. Stop giving them the power. Right? The only power they had was to do the action. Don't give them any power on your Healing journey. No, 2 (1h 55m 10s): No. That's up to you. And I think relinquishing a lot of that energy. I mean they've done studies that if you're holding onto like whether it's like anger or jealousy or whatever kind of grudge, it actually can manifest as weight. Like actual physical weight on you 0 (1h 55m 25s): Feels that way. We all have experienced that feel 2 (1h 55m 27s): The weight, but we also can gain the weight. So Oh 0 (1h 55m 30s): There is Oh, 2 (1h 55m 30s): Interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 0 (1h 55m 31s): Like you'll eat, eat to compensate, eat, 2 (1h 55m 33s): Or your body will start storing it, right? Like the body keeps the score. We process it in different ways. So some people that could be like belly fat or whatever, you're like, yeah, your butt starts getting bigger and if you start doing, I 0 (1h 55m 43s): Just need to figure out who's fucked with me to make my butt bigger. I'm like, this is your fault. I'm just kidding. I knew it was something, 2 (1h 55m 50s): Something's 0 (1h 55m 50s): Happening. Not, not what I was eating. 2 (1h 55m 52s): Some kinda energy is back there. 0 (1h 55m 55s): It's that big ass energy. 2 (1h 55m 56s): Seriously. 0 (1h 55m 58s): I just totally derailed. That's the squirrel in me. I'm like nuts, okay, butt, 2 (1h 56m 4s): Did someone say butt? 0 (1h 56m 4s): Did someone say a big butt? 2 (1h 56m 6s): But when you start doing this feeling, you'll actually, you could actually start seeing, you lose physical weight and then you'll start feeling better. So if you can get to the point where you don't even need to do those Exercises because you're like, there was no wrongdoing and I'm not holding that, then that's amazing. But definitely like the worst thing you could do is nothing. Like the worst thing is if you have the feelings right, is like harbor and say this is my righteous anger and I'm entitled to it. But on the flip side, so getting into those people that are perpetually Healing, right? Like there is almost a culture of I'm 0 (1h 56m 36s): I'm broken, 2 (1h 56m 37s): I'm so broken, and my traumas and this is my 17th ayahuasca journey in two days. And God told me through a direct download like all of like it's everywhere. And it's not to say that this doesn't happen with some people, but there are people that are abusing it or that are identifying with this perpetuated victim mentality. Yeah. 0 (1h 56m 57s): Unconsciously, I assume most of it, right? 2 (1h 56m 59s): Hopefully. Yeah. Hopefully it's not conscious. But how do you start to wake up or are there any traps to avoid and constantly being stuck in Healing culture? 0 (1h 57m 10s): That is a really good one. I remember I had a coach one time tell me, you don't need to read anymore books, Alicia. And I was like, what do you mean I don't need to read anymore books? She was like, no, you need to look inside of you. The wisdom's already there. And we kind of hit on that earlier. The wisdom isn't owned by anyone. It's there if you want to access it. And so will we all always be on a journey of growth? Yes. Am I always on a journey of Healing? No. And I think that I'm on even less journeys of Healing as I've accepted that there's nothing to forgive. These are all growing experiences. That's it. That's all it is. It's just a game. It's like, oh, okay, this happened and now I get to grow and I can set a new boundary for myself. 0 (1h 57m 52s): I'm creating my reality. We all are. And so even especially with close relationships, when I feel hurt, that's cue to me of like, okay, I feel hurt. What am I gonna do about this? Am I gonna talk with them about it? Am I gonna set a new boundary for myself? Am I gonna, and the most beautiful thing is when you can feel that and then you can wish the person the best. It's like, you know what? I hope that all of your heart's desires come true. I hope that all of the love, joy, and happiness that you're looking for, you find and in that, so will I. So it's, I don't have anything to back that up. It's just my own journey of what I've experienced. And I'm not saying that's always easy, but I do think that when you associate Healing to it, you're also accepting some victim. 0 (1h 58m 40s): And it's like, yes, we've all all been, we've all been victims at times. You can't help that, but you can choose how you respond to that. So yeah. 2 (1h 58m 48s): Yeah. And then I guess just for me, my perspective would be asking, are you staying somewhere really long because of the sense of community that you're getting there, that you're not getting elsewhere? Like if you heal, then maybe you're not allowed in that club anymore. Or maybe you're not gonna have those same, like that same tribe. And then what does that look like? How do I go back into the big world by myself? And I think that that can be overwhelming, but I think a really good calibrator is just like looking who you surround yourself with most of the time. Is everyone else also Healing broken? Trying to, you know, like never arriving, right? Yeah. And like, and maybe that's not the right way to put it because I think like if I say arriving, then that means you're done. 2 (1h 59m 29s): Like I don't mean that by any stretch, but just a place where you are content. Yeah. You're not blaming, we're not trying to mend, you're just being able to like look at your 0 (1h 59m 38s): Surroundings. Just you. Yeah. 2 (1h 59m 38s): Oh and so happy with 0 (1h 59m 40s): It. Yeah, yeah. Accepting where you are and where others are on in their journey. It's like they're, it's not about the destination, it's about the journey. And it's like we can create this journey to be as painful as we desire or as beautiful. So it's where do you wanna put your focus? You know? Are you looking for the bliss and the Magic? Because whenever I focus on that, so much more of it happens and I'm just like, oh my God, look at this. I kind of was telling you a story. The other, the other, or last night, the other day. Like I've been here for weeks. You can never trust me when I'm like, oh, the other day that could be like two hours ago, two days ago, two hours ago or two years ago. It's like, who knows? My 2 (2h 0m 18s): Time is a construct. 0 (2h 0m 19s): Yeah. It's not real. Except for when you have an appointment with me, I'm really good. Like please be on time. No, but that being said, I think it's, it's interesting how you choose to look at facts, creates your reality. So our assistance had a mess up on like what days I was supposed to be here when flights were, and I chuckled with myself because five years ago I would've been so annoyed I probably, I think you, you or your assistant sent my assistant like, Hey, if we need to reschedule, it's totally fine. And I was just like, oh no, you don't need to reschedule. Just fix it. Like it's gonna fall. It's gonna fall into place. Right. And that's when I chuckled because I was like five years ago I would've been so uptight about it and I'm like, oh no, no, Magic is happening. 0 (2h 1m 3s): And I saw the Magic and because of this mess up, I got to meet the muse that I've had for 20 years. And I'm like, what a huge blessing because I was willing to go with the flow instead of micromanage and control everything and the piece that came with that. Whereas five years ago I would've been so twisted like well figure it out, let's figure this and da da. And I was like, it's all gonna fall into place. It just is. And I trust that God or the universe knows more than I do so, and that it's all working out for my good 2 (2h 1m 35s): Divine intervention. Yeah. 0 (2h 1m 37s): Or Divine creation. I'm like, I was the only one. We were the ones that were in the black. Like we didn't know we are in the dark. Yeah. We didn't know. But the universe did. The universe knew where everything was happening. So it's like we're along for this beautiful ride. I'm not saying we don't have decision and input, but our decision and input I think is more so how we decide to respond and receive then create and demand if you will. Like so much more fun that way. 2 (2h 2m 3s): So when it comes to Receiving, do you have practices like any Meditations that you get into a place, like if we talked about Dispensa a little bit earlier and he has this analogy where your mind is kind of like the antenna and your heart is the receiver. So you can kind of like cast out what you want. Like whether it's a job, a lover, a place that you wanna move to, but unless you get to a place where you are feeling gratitude, embodying bliss and being in that moment like going into the quantum field and like being in that place that you're actually not gonna be in a place to receive. And again to we're, we're getting in the woo, we've got the grist, 0 (2h 2m 40s): I 2 (2h 2m 40s): Love the Woo man. Women are just like, we're more able to receive, like we're able to like create, we're 0 (2h 2m 46s): Built for it, we're 2 (2h 2m 47s): Great, we're like built for it. But I think a lot of us, because of where we are like living in this domineering energy, we're blocking it unknowingly. So how do you get into a place where you can like tap into the Receiving energy and like that bliss and gratitude? 0 (2h 3m 1s): Yeah, so for me, and I think you hit the nail on the head whenever I am in my masculine in that like slide and crush it, which I try to avoid it now. I'm like, I was so in that for so long that for me, my goal is like I don't need any help being in my masculine at all. I can close my eyes and be there instantaneously. For me it's my feminine. And so the way that I know that I'm in Receiving mode is do I feel blissful and happy and joyful and like a little kid? And the cue that I got was when I talked to my really good Girlfriends who are also magical, I'm always, I always chuckle because I'm like, I sound like I'm 11. I'm like, Hey girl, guess what I, and like we just back and forth and I'm like, that's pure joy. 0 (2h 3m 44s): There's no ulterior motives, there's no controlling, there's just enjoyment of what I have received. Right? And so I try to remind myself of that feeling and get back to that. And we kind of hit on that yesterday. It's about feelings more so than I want this car, I want this house, I want, I want the feeling. What is the feeling that I think that I'm gonna have by having that thing? And then what I'm looking for and placing that into the universe is that feeling how the universe brings me. That feeling that I am open to. Some people might not be, I have to have this specific car, but I think that creates resistance. And resistance doesn't create anything good. So I'm like, no, I'm open to, I want, if I want that car that I think I want, really what I'm wanting is the freedom and the feeling that I think I will get driving that car going 120 miles an hour or the wind in my hair, the top down. 0 (2h 4m 34s): That's what I'm really looking for. And so that's what I concentrate on when I'm meditating is the feelings. 2 (2h 4m 41s): Yeah. 0 (2h 4m 42s): I don't know if that's right or not, but all of this woowoo stuff, it's like who knows? 2 (2h 4m 45s): Who knows? Try it out. Let's 0 (2h 4m 46s): See, are you happy? You know, are you joyful? Are you able to be you? Then I think that's, that tells whether it's working or not. 2 (2h 4m 53s): Well, I can't believe it, but we've been here for over two hours. 0 (2h 4m 57s): Get out this What happened last night? Dude, 2 (2h 4m 59s): We like 10 o'clock. We're like, oh my gosh. She was, had a three hour dinner. Sorry 0 (2h 5m 4s): Guys. 2 (2h 5m 5s): We seriously should have made this three-part series. No, 0 (2h 5m 7s): You can. I mean it's yours. Do what you want with 2 (2h 5m 9s): It. Yeah. Oh my gosh, you were so lovely. I could do this for another two hours. I enjoyed this easily. Before we leave, do you wanna tell the listeners where they can follow you, how they can support you, and maybe any projects that you're working on? Oh 0 (2h 5m 22s): Sure. So just Elisha, Covey on Instagram or TikTok or whatever's easier for you. Also YouTube. So pretty much anywhere it's just Elisha, Covey and new things that I'm working on. Hopefully this year I'll have a cookbook out from my bakeries, which was my first entrepreneurial venture. So I'll be looking out for that one. Couture cupcakes this year and a few more surprises, but we'll just let those kind of come out as they do. 2 (2h 5m 44s): Awesome. Well thank you so much and thank you for listening. If you have a minute, please leave a five star review that helps with the algorithm. Hit like and subscribe and we'll see you next time. Yay buddy.